OH Boy - not good news

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Just a thought...what if you offered him a few links to rat care sites without saying anything to make him think you're trying to prove a point about what he's doing wrong? What if you just told him you thought he might like as much info as possible as to how to keep the rats healthy and happy? Is there a chance he'd read up on the subject and learn more about rats and how they aren't discriminatory breeders and how much goes into their care and feeding?

I don't know...gosh, this is frustrating enough to read! I can't imagine what it's like to live it!
 
If you find out for sure which store sold him the rats and the stupid advice I will be sure to go and talk to the Manager myself. If necessary I can even talk to the breeder (who I suspect supplies that store) and ask him to also speak to the Manager. Much as I disagree with his practices I am able to have a civil conversation with him and can point out that it hurts his business to have rats breeding uncontrolled.

You have given me the idea to do up a little pamphlet on rat care that I can offer to give them for free to hand out to new rat owners. It won't help the ones your brother has but might prevent other disasters.

As for the babies, if they are willing to let you take some try and get all of one sex - either all the boys or all the girls. That should help slow down the baby making.
 
aw geez, I read this on page 1 and figured you'd sort it out. Just checked page 3 sure that everything was ok now and it's not. :evil:
Your brother is clueless about this and even worse he's definitely opposed to listening to you.
Is he manic right now? That makes a big difference in how to reason with someone (yeah, I have a lot of experience in that as I'm sure you do) but his desire to keep breeding and giving them to the pet store doesn't sound manic at all, it sounds like a spoiled kid screaming for attention. Manic is self-protective, not self-enhancing.
I think if he's really attached to the mom you should offer to have her fixed for him - as a gift - because then she will be less distracted by other ratty duties and more able to just focus on him so they can really tune into each other and there is so much they can learn from each other.
The babies - can you lie and say you have homes for them?
 
:cry:
Perhaps he could keep the male and female separate and after she has her second litter and they are weaned, he could have her spayed if he wants to keep both her and the male. If he doesn't have a second cage, maybe someone could lend him one ...
Hopefully he will accept your advice re nutrition and if you can get all the babies from him prior to 5 weeks, then they should be ok.

As previously mentioned, does he want "his babies" to be fed alive to snakes ... if not perhaps he will listen to reason.

good luck.
 
I agree with Mumsy, see if you can get all of the one sex from him...all the boys or all the girls, this will mean of course Dad or Mom too. I am sure in this type of emergency we can figure out homes for most of them. :(

He is totally going to be inundated with rats if he is relying on horrid information like that....a scent that stops siblings from breeding together? :doh:

I am soo sorry LA, its painful to be soo close to being able to do some real good and then find out this. I would be physically sick at this thought. ((hugs))
 
He didn't even show up today. I have so many bad words for him. ARG...

Well I am going to get a bunch of websites together and email my stepmom and just tell her to get him to read them if she can. Tell her it will allow him to become more informed rat owner in general.

So if you have any websites you think would be good, why not to breed, info on rats etc. Please feel free to post them and I will put them in the email.

Of course I am going to give him this one.
 
LA said:
He didn't even show up today. I have so many bad words for him. ARG...

Well I am going to get a bunch of websites together and email my stepmom and just tell her to get him to read them if she can. Tell her it will allow him to become more informed rat owner in general.

So if you have any websites you think would be good, why not to breed, info on rats etc. Please feel free to post them and I will put them in the email.

Of course I am going to give him this one.
Click to expand...

If he is bipolar and manic depressive then it is likely that he is under a doctor's care. Someone needs to speak with his doctor. If his rat mania develops into something he can't control; he will have the authorities on his back as well as any animal advocate groups.

You may also want to point out the fact that selling the babies to a petstore will only see them landing in a snake cage. Not the kindest thing to do to a female he "hangs" on.

Before you get too angry Le-Andra, remember that your step-brother is sick. Animals have been known to help people with depressive disorders. Ryan does not need the anger. He needs someone who he trusts to provide him with information on the potential evils of what he is doing. Although I have absolutely no insight into your family; I am hopeful that gentle persuasion from his parents and any medical specialists may help him to see the light.

Don't beat him up sweetie... you need to be working through the back door. Do yourself a favor and keep a healthy distance from him. There is no point in letting any rage or hatred fester up inside. You need to take a step outside the box and deal with this catastrophe in a calm and level headed manner. Once the rat issue has solved itself, I would suggest that you fully distance yourself from Ryan and give your sweet soul a break.

Yes, he is being selfish but I do not have the impression that he is capable of mature logic. You are capable Le-Andra. See who you can work with, both family and any medical doctors. Ryan needs help. Being told to f-off and then being hung up on will not help him respect your knowledge of rats and their breeding patterns. ;)

Breathe Sweetie. You are absolutely correct in your views. You only need to relay your knowledge in a calm and to the point fashion with those close to him. Trust me, you will get much further in your endeavors.

In the worst case scenario, contact Animal control or an animal advocate group and give them an exact account of what is happening. No one wants a million rats being "cared for" by someone suffering from a depressive disorder. Asking the law for help is an option if you feel that you are getting nowhere.

I hope this helps Le-Andra. You're ok sweetie. Just breathe deep. I can fully relate to how you are feeling. :love6:
 
Thanks Jen, I know he's sick but it is really hard. He's caused my dad so much upheaval. Both times he's gone to jail he was living with my dad and stepmom and the house had been raided and my dad's computer (with his own business stuff on it) was taken away. I just get frustrated with him. But yes I do have to realize all of this. He is on meds but he has the habit of going off of them for whatever his reasons.

I did call him back that day and appologize. I realize why he didn't show up, I basically beat him down and he didn't want that happening again. SO I will work from the background.

THank you all for your support.
 
Well I talked to my friend that lives in Barrie that used to date my stepbrother and I told her about what happened. Now she lived with someone a while ago that owned rats so she somewhat understand some stuff. So she said she wanted to talk to him. She said she would leave me out of it. My stepbrother still has a little thing for her she says so he might listen to her.

I told her not to get to overly into it if he causes her grief. But I thanked her for her help. She told me to get a bunch of sites and info for her so she would be ready for him.

We'll see how that goes.
 
Hey Jennifervb, that's an awesome post as far as understanding what's going on with LA's brother and how it affects the family. And offering insight and good suggestions for dealing with both his behaviour and their own pain & frustration. I've never seen a textbook do better and i've read plenty.

LA, I know you are are in the midst of 'having to fix it' but I hope you can read and reread what Jennifervb said and know that you are not your brother, and he is your responsibility when it comes to family stuff, but when it comes to the rattie stuff he is not your responsibility.

Can you send info to your rattie friends and the ex when you hear it? Off your shoulders and onto theirs? But make this the one rescue situation you are not allowed to rescue ratties from.
Give his email address to your most trustied rattie allies so they can send him the info on the sites and breeding and stuff and try to befriend him and reason with him? They couldn't have worse hope of being heard than a sister who is looking righteous making him look otherwise in his mind.
 
LA said:
Thanks Jen, I know he's sick but it is really hard. He's caused my dad so much upheaval. Both times he's gone to jail he was living with my dad and stepmom and the house had been raided and my dad's computer (with his own business stuff on it) was taken away. I just get frustrated with him. But yes I do have to realize all of this. He is on meds but he has the habit of going off of them for whatever his reasons.

I did call him back that day and appologize. I realize why he didn't show up, I basically beat him down and he didn't want that happening again. SO I will work from the background.

THank you all for your support.
Click to expand...

We have a family friend who has been on meds for most of her life and she does the same thing Ryan does. She reaches a point where she is feeling so good that she thinks she doesn't need her meds anymore. It usually takes less than 1-2 weeks before she is packed up by the authorities and placed in a psychiatric unit. Depression and bipolar disorder are a nightmare for all involved; especially the patient.

I feel for your dad and stepmom Le-Andra but from the standpoint of the authorities it is likely that your dad's computer was not confiscated because of anything your father was doing wrong. Anything Ryan has or had access to can eventually be used as evidence against him. It is very painful for a parent to have to realize that trying to help a loved one may not be something they are capable of. If Ryan has been to jail then he obviously needs the kind of "hard loving care" that only a trained professional can give him. In most cases, parents and family do not have the necessary background. :(

I know this post probably sucks for you to read Le-Andra and I don't relish writing it. I just have some insight into legal proceedings and have a working knowledge of how things are processed based on my professional background and experiences from my past (and present), and I want you to be able to use anything you can to help you and Ryan's rats (lol... that sounds cute...LOL :D!!!) get through this ordeal.

Have there been any changes in circumstances since?

Hang in there Le-Andra; You're gonna make it. :love6:
 
Fidget said:
Hey Jennifervb, that's an awesome post as far as understanding what's going on with LA's brother and how it affects the family. And offering insight and good suggestions for dealing with both his behaviour and their own pain & frustration. I've never seen a textbook do better and i've read plenty.

LA, I know you are are in the midst of 'having to fix it' but I hope you can read and reread what Jennifervb said and know that you are not your brother, and he is your responsibility when it comes to family stuff, but when it comes to the rattie stuff he is not your responsibility.

Can you send info to your rattie friends and the ex when you hear it? Off your shoulders and onto theirs? But make this the one rescue situation you are not allowed to rescue ratties from.
Give his email address to your most trustied rattie allies so they can send him the info on the sites and breeding and stuff and try to befriend him and reason with him? They couldn't have worse hope of being heard than a sister who is looking righteous making him look otherwise in his mind.
Click to expand...

Thanks Fidget, :hugs: :love6:

I've been down a long and winding road with people and I've seen a great deal. I have always had too level a head but have seen the grief which depression and illness can inflict on family, friends and loved ones. It is a harsh world.

As far as bipolar disorder is concerned; I am no medical doctor. I have only been a witness to what can result from it for both the patient and the family. We (our group of friends) had a friend, in High School, who suffered under severe depression. I did not know his parents very well, but had the information that they tended to distance themselves from such issues and were not supportive. They made it clear, to all their 3 children, that they would have to leave home when they turned 18 and they were provided with no form of support, neither monetary or emotional.

Our friend was a "silent type" depressive. He never shared what he was feeling and never seemed to accept any advice from those of us who could see when he was depressed. He shot himself through the head when he was 19. I couldn't bring myself to go to the funeral because I could not promise not to take his parents to task. I felt that they were solely responsible for Joe's death and that left me feeling awful. I couldn't figure out why I was feeling guilty so I tried to analyse my feelings.

I came to the conclusion that Joe's parents were victims too. They did not have the resources to deal with his severe depressions and, in the end, the lapse in judgement cost them one of the most kind-hearted and talented people imaginable.

I can relate to Le-Andra because I have a pretty good idea how she may be feeling. It must be even harder for her because the man in question is a member of her family. Joe was only my friend and I still feel miserable when I think of him. I just wish there had been someone there to share their experiences and advice with Joe and his family. Maybe he would still be here and be the star author he dreamed of being. :tearful:

If anything I've experienced can help someone to avoid such a scenario, as the one I have shared here, then I take comfort in knowing that Joe's suicide was not completely in vain. :rose: :heart:
 

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