...Moncton SPCA girl had babies..they're gone!

[nattykins]

That was awesome! I really hope they take notice of the situation!

 

[Dahlas]

Great letter twitch......

 

[SQ]

Wonderful letter!!

Please write polite, concerned letters to the media and politicians about this so that the Moncton SPCA becomes safe for rats ... or where will they go?

I posted addresses and links last night.
This is one way everyone can help.

 

[Jherek]

Nanette responded (did anyone else get one? :\) *clicky* Let's see...

Hello......

I am sorry that you feel that you have been ignored. I have been away at a summit and have just returned. Yes, all of your emilas are here. As you can imagine there are many issues that I need to bring myself up to speed on. This being one. I wanted to make sure that I spoke with appropriate staff and had gathered as much info as I could before making a hasty reply.

I appreciate your concern for these little guys. Let me being by saying that I really liked this pair. When they arrived to our care they were housed together and it was I that requested they be separated. I instructed that they be housed directly next to each other to allow them to still feel connected. I had hoped beyond all hope that she may not be pregnant.

However, I am told that she had several babies while I was away. The primary care givers to that room would be the ones that would be aware of the babies. While we do our best to keep the mama's happy, I am sure you can appreciate that it is a very stressful environment for them. The babies were not "disposed of, for any reason--intentional or not".

As far as the housing concerns, yes they were placed on pine at the time. We know that is not the best for them and when we are able to obtain correct bedding we use it. They are being fed rat food - it does appear to look like cat food to a layman- the staff are great at bringing the little creatures special treats of fresh vegetable and fruits.

We do the best we can with what we have. I take great offense to your suggestion that I would carelessly throw out a creature in the care of my shelter as if it were "trash".

This is an unfortunate case. However, I am thrilled that these guys found a new and loving home. They were great rats.

We have had many babies born here due to someone else's carelessness and they have been rehomed and are happy.

I hope his sets your mind at ease a little.

Nanette

So I guess she's claiming that the mom just ate the babies and there was nothing they could have done, case closed.

 

[lindsayfawn]

I'm really glad twitch that you did up that letter and timeline looks really great! I still have not gotten any emails so Jherek you are lucky you have been getting them. I really can not see Elizabeth eating her babies because at how protective she was of them and where Nanette said that they "We know that is not the best for them and when we are able to obtain correct bedding we use it." Well maybe if they take pine off the friggin list of things they want for the shelter and put care fresh they would get that as donations.

They are the ones that are making more problems for themselves by not fixing these types of very small things. This email doesn't put my mind at ease as the email doesn't say anything about the babies and where they went. It's like she's trying to get us to think 'oh the mother just ate them' done deal. It's not a done deal, if there are specific people to care for them in that room then shouldn't they know something or the people at the front desk when I went there could have said they would go get the person who takes care of them to answer our questions. But they didn't do that they said I don't know and basically their body language said I don't give a sh!t.

I'm very unimpressed of this and I really hope no other rats go there. If they do I'll make sure to do what I can to either get them out of there or visit them every day so something like this doesn't happen again. It's also annoying that the SPCA won't even let Clark adopt them knowing he is the rat man and knows what he's doing. They would be better off with him then at the SPCA considering they don't have two clues on what they're doing.
And it was friggin cat food! I might be a 'laymen' to some of you here who have had rats for a long time but I know the difference between cat food and rat food. That really irks me. :rant: :rant: :rant: :rant: :rant: :rant: :rant: :rant:

 

[Jherek]

I know, the "layman" comment made me laugh. But, I don't think it's cat food - it looks like a hamster seed mix with those little... uh, "bits" in them. Either way, you donated a bunch of blocks, right? So...

Why won't they let Clark adopt?

And I sent an e-mail in response by the way, I just forgot to mention it. Basically they're just saying that the mother was stressed and ate the babies so "meh, what can you do?". Did you get a response yourself? I don't know why they've been responding to only me thus far. :\ A few times she mistook others' emails for mine (cat food, disposed of in the trash, etc.). I tried to mention everything in my response, I hope it's ok:

Hello,

We realize now that we were not ignored by you are Heather. However, given that 2-3 days after the babies were born, the front desk staff was still unaware of their existence, this raises many concerns; who was aware of their existence and caring for them? Who was in charge in your absence? Were you on call? It seems no one capable of dealing with such an important issue was available.

Everyone who has e-mailed you is very aware of their situation and very educated regarding rats and their care. We know how they came into your care, and a staff member informed us that they had been there for one and a half months. Given a rat's gestation period, this makes it physically impossible for Elizabeth to have come into your shelter pregnant. Can you please check and confirm how long these two were at your shelter?

The babies were placed in a high traffic area, entirely inappropriate for a new mother, and this poor choice of location may have contributed to their death. Of course, there is another very possible scenario, and that is that they were accidentally thrown out by staff who was uninformed of the situation and threw them out with bedding; this makes the lack of response even more troubling, as if the situation had been dealt with immediately by whoever was left in charge, perhaps they could have been saved. Were all staff who cared for them in any way aware of the babies?

As for food - I believe you're confusing my e-mail with someone elses. I never said they were on cat food. However, it's clear that they're on a poor quality "rat diet" that is, in reality, a generic seed mix that results in the rats picking and choosing and not getting all the nutrition they require. A cheap lab block costs the same as a cheap seed mix. However, a large donation of lab-quality rat blocks were recently made - why are they not simply being used instead? And while it's great that the staff brings them in fresh vegetables sometimes, that doesn't replace the lack of nutrition from a proper lab block.

As for the pine bedding - rats have such incredibly sensitive respiratory tracts, and the phenols released, which are bad for any animal, act as a natural insecticide, so you can see why this isn't just not "ideal," but unacceptable. Respiratory illnesses are the most common problem in rats, and you are contributing to that problem. You would take a dog away for being tied outside with dirty water and not enough shade - well, placing rats on pine is actively contributing to respiratory illnesses for them. Studies have shown that the phenols will actually destroy cells lining the lungs and trachea, and may even cause cancer within the respiratory tract. Throwing down a few layers of paper towel would be better than this.


We have had many babies born here due to someone else's carelessness and they have been rehomed and are happy.


That's what concerns us even more: that, according to your staff, they were born due to a staff member's carelessness. Then, they were given inadequate care in every regard.

Nanette simply responded:

I cannot change what happened, perceived or real. I can however, ensure that steps will be taken to provide any rats in our future with improved environment and care.

Now, I don't know what the first line means - she hasn't said what actually happened or that she's even really looked into it. Given my lengthy e-mail, her two sentence response is a bit frustrating. I guess she feels she doesn't have to answer to a layman.

 

[lindsayfawn]

I know, the "layman" comment made me laugh. But, I don't think it's cat food - it looks like a hamster seed mix with those little... uh, "bits" in them. Either way, you donated a bunch of blocks, right? So...

The first day I went in all they had in their dish was the cat food and the next day when I saw the babies gone they had that seed mix and one or two lab blocks in there. Ang and I donated over half a bag of the food Clark had given us and Clark himself donated a few boxes of that food from the rat train effort. So there is no excuse as to why they are not on lab blocks. We have 16 rats and one box of that food is lasting us months so how is it that when they have only 2 or 3 rats at a time they have no lab blocks to feed the rats?
Obviously they are feeding it to other animals which isn't good considering those lab blocks are SPECIFICALLY for rats!

Why won't they let Clark adopt?

Clark told me they won't let him adopt he's not sure why and he has gone there many a times to offer help, he's going to see if he can get in as a volunteer then at least if he can't adopt them out he can be there to help care for them.

It will be interesting if Ang and I are put on a flag list after all this too. I know I'll be watching their site if any more rats come in.

Did you get a response yourself?

I have not gotten an emails from either Heather or Nanette or the NB SPCA. No one. Which is very frustrating.

I can't believe how short her email is and it's very curt like as if to say drop the subject and let it be. That's not right :redhot:

 

[Jherek]

Ooooh all right. I didn't realize they were on yet another diet before the pictures were taken. Well, either way, it's a waste of the resources you provided and not appropriate for rats.

I cannot believe none of them have responded to you. I have no bloody idea why they're choosing to respond to me. :|

"I can't believe how short her email is and it's very curt like as if to say drop the subject and let it be. That's not right :redhot:"

That's exactly what it comes off as... she didn't address any of the questions I brought up. Well, Twitch, take it away LOL

Trying again:

Nanette,

We understand that what happened cannot be changed. That doesn't mean it doesn't deserve attention, though.

I asked quite a few specific questions in my previous e-mail, and you ignored them. I will not simply accept a response of "What's done is done. We'll work on giving them better care." These questions must be answered. Would you accept such an answer from someone you've deemed it appropriate to have an animal confiscated from?

1. What happened to the babies. How do you know for sure that's what happened? Were all staff who had anything to do with the care of these babies aware of their presence? Did anyone do anything with the cage who was not aware of this? Is it possible that were accidentally thrown out with the bedding, due to a lack of organization on the shelter's part? Where will pregnant/nursing rats be kept in the future?

2. Regarding food - I have been made aware that prior to the pictures being taken, they were indeed on cat food. It was purely kibble, not even seeds, and no lab blocks - rat food does not come as kibble. What exactly were they being fed, and why? Probably a year's supply of high quality blocks made SPECIFICALLY for rats were recently donated to you. Given that you've only had a couple rats in your care, that supply should last you a very long time. Why were the donated resources being wasted? There is no reason for them to not be purely on a lab block at this point.

3. Regarding bedding - pine is not only dangerous for rats, but for other animals as well - it's not even healthy for humans. Yet you specifically have it listed as a request for donations on your website. Since you have vowed to improve their care, I assume that your website will be updated immediately to remove "pine bedding" from the list and replace it with "aspen" and "carefresh" and such. People who simply want to help the shelter may specifically go out and purchase this because you requested it, whereas you could be getting donations of appropriate bedding instead. I will also assume that rats will not be placed on pine anymore as you are now aware of the very serious issues it will cause for them.

4. Again, according to the date provided by one of your staff, it would have been physically impossible for Elizabeth to have come into your shelter already pregnant. This means that she became pregnant while at your shelter. Please confirm the date that they arrived. Who is responsible for allowing this to happen and what is being done about it? As well, what day did Elizabeth give birth, and on what day did they disappear?

Thank you

 

[twitch]

oh wow... well if the leader of the organization has that sort of attitude about it, then it is no wonder why the rest of the staff share the same one. i have not received any word from the radio station in regards to my letter but a response is not guaranteed. in fact they warn that they may not be able to reply. keep posting all the information that you get on the matter and any letters you send out and i will see what i can do about keeping the radio up to date on it until they tell me go away.

 

[nattykins]

I received the same response from Nanette...Looks like she'll just send the same one to everyone...

Those were great responses Jherek!

 

[SQ]

As far as I know:

The woman in charge doesn't like Clark.
They view Clark as a hoarder so will not adopt to him. (He did have about 120 rats plus other animals just this summer.)
When a shelter adopts out animals, they adopt them out to good permanent homes, they don't give them to people to rehome. That would not make sense.

 

[rat.charmer]

Keep sending it the press and your MP guys. Does the SPCA have an oversight or ombudsmen? Additionally, if the press hasn't picked up on this, write letters to the editor - they will often publish those without an accompanying story! Also - have you guys spread the word to Goosemoose and other animal advocacy group? Often colleges and universities will have animal rights or animal law associations.

 

[Alicemcmallis]

Just to play Devil's advocate here - while it's completely unacceptable that no one seems to know what happened to these babies or are choosing not to let you guys know that, the bedding issue is something that I wouldn't personally focus on.

They are a shelter and as such have limited funds. If they don't ask for donations of pine shavings and only ask for Carefresh or similar, how much bedding do you think will be donated? I would say next to none, if any. No one's going to donate bags of Carefresh or other suitable bedding type that costs any significant amount of money, and they sure can't afford to buy it on a regular basis.

Having said that, maybe someone could suggest using towels or blankets as an alternative to the pine? I'm sure that's similar to what they use for the cats and dogs, so it's not like it would add much laundry or cleaning time for them. The time spent cleaning would be less if anything. And they could at least add the alternatives to the wish list instead of just pine, just in case.

If lab blocks hadn't been donated to them I would say the same thing - they use what they're given, they can't afford to be picky (beggars can't be choosers?).

Clark told me they won't let him adopt he's not sure why and he has gone there many a times to offer help

Maybe it's because he had over 100 rats in his care and needed help with rehoming them? They may think he has a problem knowing his limits and as such is on their DNA list?

 

[rat.charmer]

Hey

Looks like the Moncton SPCA just took a big hit in their pocket books:

http://www.cbc.ca/canada/new-brunswick/ ... eipts.html

 

[rat.charmer]

And has anybody contacted their head office @ http://www.spca-nb.ca/English/contact.php


edit: I've contacted my Animal Law Society group at school. Let's hope they can give us suggestions.

 

[theratlady]

if they were feeding martins rat rations then it does look kinda like cat food.

so im glad she got her facts before she emailed you and let you know what happened to the babies. geeze so no one is accountable?

 

[RatsForever]

Hey

Looks like the Moncton SPCA just took a big hit in their pocket books:

http://www.cbc.ca/canada/new-brunswick/ ... eipts.html

This is not good news for the cats and dogs (not that I think rats are less). Humane Societies struggle financially, which may account for the lack of properly trained staff and volunteers (especially when it comes to small animals like rats). Their budget is so thin that they feel money could be better spent on cats and dogs and sadly, not on anything smaller than a cat. I've volunteered at humane societies in the past and I've seen the difficult choices they have to make all because they have little funding. I certainly don't excuse the actions of the Moncton SPCA regarding the baby rats but I just wonder if they had sufficient funds for education and training, would there be less irresponsible actions? I don't know.

That said...I never did receive a response from the SPCA regarding the letter I sent to them. Now, THAT is terrible PR. Of course, the Fredericton SPCA never responded to my letter regarding their partnership with a pet store that sell live animals, even after I donated $100.00 worth of rat supplies. Again, that is bad PR and that has nothing to do with funding. fftopic:

 

[twitch]

Just to play Devil's advocate here - while it's completely unacceptable that no one seems to know what happened to these babies or are choosing not to let you guys know that, the bedding issue is something that I wouldn't personally focus on.

why not harp about the bedding? it may not be a focus point but it is certainly a valid concern that needs addressing. its dangerous and they are there to provide proper care and dangerous bedding is not providing proper care. did anyone else notice the clay based cat litter in the cage? ingestion of this litter can cause impaction and very painful death in a relatively short matter of time. alongside that they were on pine which contributes to poorer quality of life due to struggling health issues and can actively contribute to their death after a prolonged illness.

They are a shelter and as such have limited funds. If they don't ask for donations of pine shavings and only ask for Carefresh or similar, how much bedding do you think will be donated? I would say next to none, if any. No one's going to donate bags of Carefresh or other suitable bedding type that costs any significant amount of money, and they sure can't afford to buy it on a regular basis.

that is no excuse. if i said i was doing the best that i can with what i have given my limited funds they would still take my animals from me if they were in improper living conditions. if they cannot properly care for the animal then they should not take them in. yes they want to help and there is a need for them, but if they cannot be bothered to make healthy alternatives for there care (like you said, how hard is it for them lay down newpaper instead of pine shavings? yeah, its not great on odor control, but neither is pine but at least newspaper won't hurt them and is readily available from all over) then they should pick up the phone and network themselves to people that can care for them properly. i recognize there is no firm rat shelter in the province but there are other resources that would be available to them if they took 10 minutes and looked things up on the net. how many of us would be opposed for more shelter workers to be part of this forum? how many of the rescues here would be willing to offer support and network resources to the SPCAs?

If lab blocks hadn't been donated to them I would say the same thing - they use what they're given, they can't afford to be picky (beggars can't be choosers?).

again, they would not accept that from a person they were taking their animals from. if they won't accept that excusewhy should we accept it from them? its a horrible double standard. even being beggers they do make requests, and they can easily adjust their website to say that pine is dangerous and request other forms of bedding. changing what they ask for is not likely to decrease donation as the people who are donating are wanting to help the animals. if the website clearly and politely said why they could no longer accept pine shavings due to it being discovered that it harms the animals, then listed a few alternatives that are not dangerous then people that are going to donate are going to still donate, but they'll donate the alternatives instead.


i know this all sounds harsh and i picked apart your post quite a bit but this is not an attack on you. i understand the value of trying to see things from the other side. playing devil's advocate can be very helpful in understanding a situation, and so i have returned your devil's advocate with a bit of my own.




my mother has found more people to contact. http://cfhs.ca/info/who_we_are/ this is a group called The Canadian Federation of Humane Societies. this is their mission statement:

As the national voice of humane societies and SPCAs, the Canadian Federation of Humane Societies supports its member animal welfare organizations across Canada in promoting respect and humane treatment toward all animals.

i think these people would be excellent people to contact and that they may be able to actually do something. here's the contact information: http://cfhs.ca/info/contact_us/

 

[Jherek]

The main thing about the bedding issue is that paper towels changed daily or old towels etc. could easily be used instead and for a much cheaper cost, so it's not just a matter of a lack of funds. It's the only bedding listed on their website as bedding they are looking for as a donation - so if people see that, that's what they'll think the shelter wants and choose that over others. Changing this would at least show they've taken SOMETHING from the buttload of e-mails they've received.

As for the food - meh, that's not the biggest issue - there are some that look kind of like cat kibble I guess, but I imagine Lindsay knows the difference. Either way, it's apparent that a great resource is going to waste. However, as it seems that they were indeed born due to the STAFF'S carelessness, I would hope that the would be giving mom and the babies the best care possible.

These aren't the main concerns but they're trying to sweep the main concern under the rug, so I figured I'd bring them up as well.

 

[twitch]

ok, i have contacted the CFHS. i am swamped and cannot spend another 7 hours on the email so its not up to par with the one sent to the radio station in quality. however, it does express our concerns and gives them lots of information as well as a link to this thread to see for themselves the concerns raised by all the members. as it has more information it is longer then the last letter of course, but the last letter is also included in it so there's a could deal that you can skip if you have already read that one.

i implore everyone else that has sent emails or wants to voice their concern to do so through them as well. from what i read about them they seem very promising on finally getting some action taken.

the following is what i sent to them:

there is a serious and concerning situation going on in the Moncton SPCA. it has been discovered that animals in their care have been kept in dangerous and unhealthy conditions and were allowed to breed while in their custody. not only that but that the resulting babies were neglected enough that the staff did not know of their existence for 2-3 days after they were born. during a later visit only a couple days later it was discovered that the babies have now gone missing. the staff does not know what has happened and even some still did not know that there even ever were any babies.

the conditions of the animals is concerning but the staff's handling of the situation has been very unprofessional and apathetic. it was many days since any replies were given and until just recently all those replies consisted of was staff telling only 1 of the 5 people that they were contacting the wrong person and that the right person was away, but would reply when they returned. never once addressing any questions on the whereabouts of the babies or any other concern.

at this point the moncton spca has finally replied. they implied that the mother had merely eaten the babies and that they are being fed properly but that a "layman" would likely not be able to tell the difference. this is ironic as it is rat enthusiasts, who have kept and cared for multiple rats for numerous years on a daily and more intimate pet basis, that they are telling this too. they have also proven their ignorance on proper rat care as they were housing them on bedding detrimental to the animals' health and safety. the reply back from nanette pearl was a brush off at best.

at this time the NB SPCA, local MPs and media have been contacted asking for an investigation and a possible overhaul of the Moncton SPCA's practices.

the following is a letter i wrote to CBC RadioONE Information Morning Moncton.

I do not know if you are aware of the situation currently going on in your local SPCA, but they are deplorable.

I belong to an online forum of pet rat enthusiasts where there is also a concentration of rescuers. It was brought to our attention on October 14th by one of the members that live in Moncton that there were rats available for adoption in the Moncton SPCA and that the female there had 5, 2-3 day old babies that appeared to be healthy.

Sadly, we were also informed that when she asked the staff at the desk about these babies they did not know that they were even there. Baby rats make a lot of noise and where they were located under the punch clock, they should have been easily noticed. For them not to have noticed for at least 2-3 days is very concerning.

An effort was begun by members of the forum to line up homes for the babies and arrange foster care for them and the adults to work on their sociability. This effort resulted in plans to be set in motion for foster care and a possible home for 2 of the babies.

During the initial visit from Lindsay, it was seen that the rats were not being housed properly or fed properly, (at the time of this visit only cat food was visible in the food dish), though they have been informed of the dangers of housing rats on pine shavings, (it will cause serious respiratory issues that can easily result in chronic illness and/or shortened life for a rat), and has recently received a large donation of food blocks specifically made for rats. This shows, not only a lack of knowledge on the proper care of certain types of animals in their care, but also that they ignore advice from those that do have that knowledge and waste donated resources.

As a result a member of the forum, Velma, and also a worker in a Nova Scotia shelter, e-mailed the Moncton shelter on October 15 to offer advice and to clarify the issue of the housing and feed. A reply was sent in prompt order from Heather, (listed on their website as being in charge of adoption-related inquiries), assuring the Velma that the rats were being housed on carefresh, (a brand name of a paper based litter that will not harm rats), and fed properly. Pictures taken the next day, October 16, proved these assertions to be false as they were on pine shavings and being fed an inadequate amount of food blocks mixed with cat food and seeds that are inappropriate for rats. The pictures also showed make-shift small round litter bins filled with clay litter which is also very dangerous to the health of a rat. Once again, this shows their ignorance on the proper care of the animals in their custody.

On October 16, a return visit by Lindsay, discovered the disappearance of all 5 babies. When asked what happened to the babies the staff were unable to provide any explanation. The babies would have been 4-5 days old at this point and though still small, they would have been more active, vocal and certainly more noticeable. It is astonishing that the staff could not explain the disappearance of pets that are supposed to be safe in their care.

The pictures of the living conditions of the remaining two adults were taken at this time and emails were sent to Heather by Lindsay and further e-mails were sent to both Heather and Nanette (the shelter manager) by Holly, another concerned forum member.

On October 17, Lindsay adopted Elizabeth and Henri (the two adults) and removed them from the SPCA. It is a sad thing that these pets, placed in the shelter to keep them from harm and to find another home, had to be taken from the shelter to provide them with that safety.

During this visit it was learned from a staff member there that these rats were actually here much longer, nearly one and a half months, but were not put up for adoption at that time because the female, Elizabeth, was fighting with another female. This means that Henri and Elizabeth had been in the shelter’s care for at least 47 days. Rat gestation is 21-23 days. This means that Elizabeth had to have been placed with a male, likely Henri, during her time in the shelter. Though their website blurb about the two rats would have you believe they were surrendered together just recently, "Although they came in together, they are now being housed separately to prevent unwanted babies." For an animal to become pregnant while in the shelter’s care is despicable. They are supposed to prevent unwanted litters, not make them.

This information resulted in a call from the Nova Scotia shelter to the Moncton SPCA reporting that they have received complaints.

Letters were also sent to the Moncton SPCA and NB SPCA, though the author of those letters is not hopeful that she will ever receive a reply.

It was not until October 19th, three days after the disappearance of the babies that any of the e-mails were replied to. Even then it was only to one of the now five people that had sent e-mails on this matter. It did not address any of the issues brought up in the e-mails, instead it merely stated that the shelter manager was away and would not be due back until Monday, but that all e-mails [of everyone’s] had been forwarded onto the shelter manager. This e-mail was sent by April Saulnier. At the time, e-mails were being addressed to Heather, (the adoption clerk), as the majority of the forum members were unaware that she was not the shelter manager. Ms, Saulnier, did not at this time choose to tell us who the proper person to contact was. It is also frustrating that it took three days for any reply to be given at all and then it is only to pass the buck, so to speak. Not only that, but that a reply was only given to one of the five people that had addressed concerns.

Lindsay, the member that had adopted the rats and first discovered all this, then sent an email to the NB SPCA.

On October 20 a person using Heather’s e-mail address, but not signing their name to it, gave the curt reply to an e-mail sent by Jherek, ((forum username), so far the only person that has been receiving replies at all)), it states "Nanette Pearl is our shelter manager." This prompted Jherek to then send an e-mail to Ms. Pearl. Shortly after the reply from an anonymous person using Heather’s e-mail, Heather also responded, informing the member that he needs to contact Nanette Pearl, but that his e-mails had been forwarded on to her, though she may take a while to reply as she also had been away and is only recently returning. All this has shown a serious lack of management and reeks of suspicious behaviour. It has now been six days since the discovery of the babies and four days since their disappearance with unprofessionalism shown throughout the course of that time. If there was any hope of finding what happened to the babies and perhaps saving them, (in the event that they were somehow accidentally thrown out with the dirty litter), it is long since passed, simply because no one at the shelter, which is designed to save the animals and care for them is interested in doing so.

At this point both the Moncton SPCA and NB SPCA have been contacted as well as local MP’s and media.

The animals concerned in this mess may only be rats; however they were placed at the shelter for their protection. It is assumed that the SPCA is there for the welfare of all animals. If this can happen to the rats, how safe are rabbits, dogs or cats that are brought to the shelter? These rats were allowed to breed, were kept in unsafe and unhealthy conditions, and were ignored enough that a female was able have given birth. The babies were 2-3 days old before being noticed, (and only then because a possible adopter pointed them out to the staff), and then disappeared without an explanation.

The handling of this situation is deplorable. It is the general feeling of the members of the forum that have been keeping tabs on this situation, that they are getting the run around in hopes that eventually they will tire and give up, instead of addressing the concern of these conditions. It is abhorrent that a shelter would not know how to care for their animals properly, or care to research proper basic needs, but even more so when they were handed the information and supplies needed to properly care for those animals and they still do not meet the basic needs of that animal to keep it safe and healthy.

This situation has many people concerned about the practices and education of SPCA staff. We would appreciate your interest in an investigation into this matter.

The following is a break down of the time line with e-mails and replies to the e-mails as were posted on the forum.

October 14
- 5, 2-3 day old, healthy babies discovered by Lindsay
- front-desk staff unaware that they were there
- noticed that rats were on pine shavings and being fed cat food though they should have lots of rat food blocks that were recently donated and have been informed numerous times on the dangers of keeping rats on pine.
-effort to find homes for the babies underway by forum members--resulted in possible home found for 2 of the babies

October 15
- first email sent by Velma re: offering advice and questioning living conditions of rats
- heather (listed on their website as being in charge of adoption-related inquiries) replies to Velma assuring her that the rats are on carefresh and getting proper nutrition:
"Hi Velma,

Thank you for your concern about the rats in our care. Being primarily an operation for cats and dogs we do the best we can with the little creatures that come through our door. Currently our rats are being fed Martin Rat Ration. We also have a female that is also eating the same along with some seeds and vegetables to give her that extra that she needs. They are being bedded on care fresh, with a litter box and houses to hide in. There is a little shavings in there for them but primarily the care fresh. We appriciate your concern and welcome any tips you can send our way.

We hope everything is great down in Bridgewater and welcome you to come and visit anytime! "

October 16
- babies discovered missing by Lindsay
- when asked, desk-staff does not know what has happened to them
- pictures of the pine bedding and improper food taken
-email sent to SPCA Heather by Lindsay
"Hi Heather,

I was by on the 14th to check in on the two rats that had been brought in. When I went in I found that Elizabeth, female rat, had 5 babies. I asked the two girls at the desk when she had them and they didn't even know she even had the babies who looked like they were around 2-3 days old. My girlfriend and I were debating on taking them because we were concerned about the conditions. They are being housed on Pine shavings which is dangerous for rats because the dust gets into their respiratory systems and makes it extremly hard for them to breath right also they had cat food in their dish.

I belong to a wonderful site on the internet called the Rat Shack and asked them what they think we should do about taking them in and one of the lady's on the shack emailed you. She belongs to a shelter in Brigewater, NS. She was assured that the rats were on Care Fresh which they are not. You can see in the attached picture that I took today that they are indeed on pine.

However being on Pine shavings and having them feed seeds(seeds are not good for them as they will only pick out what they lick which is usully the most fattening ones) is not the main reason I am emailing you today. I went back to the SPCA today to check on the mom and I found that her babies were no longer there. I asked the ladies at the desk what had happened to them and they had no idea.

I'm very sadden that they do not know what happened to her babies and I really hope that they were not thrown out when someone had changed the litter. I know sometimes mother rats will eat their young if they are dead or dying but those babies were a picture of health with great milk bands.
If you could look into this and find out what happened to those babies I would greatly appreciate it. I plan on going in tomorrow to adopt Elizabeth and possibly Henri as well. I'm just sick to think that I should have done this sooner and those 5 babies would still be alive.

Thank you for your time.
Lindsay"
- email sent to Heather and Nanette from the Moncton SPCA from Holly Sabean
“[copied email edited out until i receive permission to post it publicly]”

October 17
-Elizabeth and Henri (the rats) adopted and removed from SPCA
- more information gathered from a staff member that these 2 rats have been in the SPCA's care for at least a month and a half. Therefore, the pregnancy had to have happened at the shelter and not simply because they "came in together" which implies arrived at the SPCA together recently as their ad suggested. website description: "Although they came in together, they are now being housed separately to prevent unwanted babies." approx. month and a half in days as of October 17: 47 days; rat gestation: 21-23 days
-call from shelter in NS to Moncton SPCA reporting a complaint
-letters written to the NBSPCA and Moncton SPCA by Linda (forum member not hopeful of reply)


October 19
-first reply back from any emails on this matter from April Saulnier saying that Heather is on vacation (only replied to one person –Jherek—of the now 5 that have sent emails):
""Hello,
The shelter manager is away and should be back Monday, I have sent her all your [*everyone's] e-mails. She will respond as soon as she gets them.
Thank you for your concerns.
April Saulnier"
-another email sent to NBSPCA from Lindsay
"To Whom It May Concern:

I wanted to inform you of something that I witnessed at the Moncton SPCA. On Monday Oct 13th I went to the shelter to check on two of the rats that were brought in. There was a male and a female that had been found together so I knew there was a possibility she could be pregnant. When I got there I noticed they were on pine shavings, which is extremely dangerous for rats because of their weak repertory systems. Also they had cat food in their dish. I am uncertain why they would have cat food as they should be fed lab blocks and I donated a lot of lab blocks that should have lasted them well over 6 months. This is not my biggest problem.

When I got there the female did in fact have 5 babies that looked to be around 2-3 days old.

I asked the staff when she had her babies and they did not even know she had them! How they could not know she had babies is beyond me because newborn rats make a very distinctive eeping noise and the punch clock is directly in front of where the rats’ cage was.

I came back on Thursday to check on them again and possibly adopt them. I was shocked to see the babies were no longer there. I asked the staff what happened to the babies and they did not know. How can they not know what happened to 5 newborn babies?

Mother rats will sometimes eat their dead or dying young but this would not be the case in this situation as these babies were in perfect health and had great milk bands. Plus the mother was very protective of the babies. I very much hope that they were not thrown out when someone changed the litter and I very much hope that they were not disposed of by the staff.

I would like someone to look into this. I have already emailed a Heather at the Moncton SPCA but have yet to receive an answer. Other people know about this and other people will be sending emails to her and you that are from other shelters in different provinces. One friend of mine has done so when I had told her that these rats were on pine and she received a response that they were not on pine and that they were on care fresh.

This is not true because I saw that they were on pine and I have pictures to prove this fact. I have since adopted the female and male rat to get them out of those horrible conditions. I regret that I did not do it the first day I was there because then those 5 babies would still be alive.

I hope someone will look into what happened and that this will not be brushed aside just because they are rats. All animals should be treated the same as dogs and cats there should be no favouritism. I sincerely believe that if a dog had puppies or a cat had kittens while at the shelter they would not have just disappeared. I know the staff does not like the rats much as I was told by volunteers that when there are rats they don't get handled because people think they are gross or are afraid of them. This is very unprofessional. If they decide to work in a shelter that takes in more then just dogs and cats they should be prepared to work with any other animal that comes in.

I hope someone will be able to find out what happened to these 5 babies and inform me as to what happened to them.

Thank You"

October 20
-another reply from a person using Heather's email account but unsigned, saying that Nannette is the person that emails should be addressed to (replied to same person as before-Jherek-still no replies to the other emails):
"Nanette Pearl is our shelter manager."
-another email sent, this time to Nanette from Jherek:
"Dear Nanette,

I am many others are very concerned about the five little baby rats that were born in the Moncton SPCA's care. On October 14th, someone came in to find that the rat in your care, Elizabeth, had given birth to 5 babies. The staff was unaware of this. As of October 16th, the babies have disappeared, and no one on staff can tell us what has happened to them; indeed, some still apparently didn't even know about them. We have been trying and trying to get assistance from the Moncton SPCA in finding out what happened to these little babies, but to no avail. It has now been 4 days since they apparently "went missing" and, if it was indeed an accident, it is now obviously too late for them.

Since the 16th, our e-mails were simply ignored--however, it is apparent that April was checking Heather's e-mail in her absence, and yet she did not forward them to you or suggest we do so so that perhaps these little babies could have been saved. I finally received a very impassive response from Heather today of "Nanette is the shelter manager," without even the assurance that you have been made aware of the numerous concerns and complaints she has received. I can only assume that she did not forward the various e-mails to you. I have attached my e-mails below along with the responses I received.

Please do us the courtesy of acknowledging our concerns and assure us that the appropriate actions are being taken to find out what happened to these babies."
- reply signed from heather saying that all emails have been forwarded to Nannette and that she is only just returning from being away as well:
"Sorry, I have just returned and am not sure what history you have already, only what I got from scrolling down through your previous emails.

Yes, they have been forwarded to the Shelter Manager, Nanette Pearl. She has also just returned after being away. I will forward her this email and also remind her that you are waiting when I see her tomorrow.

Heather"
-email sent to Nanette (which is a copy of the one sent to heather earlier) from Lindsay
-copies of that email also sent to MP Brian Murphy, CTV, and to the Times and Transcript in the form of a letter to the editor
-email sent to Moncton SPCA and copies sent to local MPs and media by another concerned forum member, nattykins (do not know real name)

October 20/21
-emails sent to CBC RadioONE Information Morning Moncton



Thank you for your time and consideration in this matter.



the following is nanette's first reply:
Hello......

I am sorry that you feel that you have been ignored. I have been away at a summit and have just returned. Yes, all of your emilas are here. As you can imagine there are many issues that I need to bring myself up to speed on. This being one. I wanted to make sure that I spoke with appropriate staff and had gathered as much info as I could before making a hasty reply.

I appreciate your concern for these little guys. Let me being by saying that I really liked this pair. When they arrived to our care they were housed together and it was I that requested they be separated. I instructed that they be housed directly next to each other to allow them to still feel connected. I had hoped beyond all hope that she may not be pregnant.

However, I am told that she had several babies while I was away. The primary care givers to that room would be the ones that would be aware of the babies. While we do our best to keep the mama's happy, I am sure you can appreciate that it is a very stressful environment for them. The babies were not "disposed of, for any reason--intentional or not".

As far as the housing concerns, yes they were placed on pine at the time. We know that is not the best for them and when we are able to obtain correct bedding we use it. They are being fed rat food - it does appear to look like cat food to a layman- the staff are great at bringing the little creatures special treats of fresh vegetable and fruits.

We do the best we can with what we have. I take great offense to your suggestion that I would carelessly throw out a creature in the care of my shelter as if it were "trash".

This is an unfortunate case. However, I am thrilled that these guys found a new and loving home. They were great rats.

We have had many babies born here due to someone else's carelessness and they have been rehomed and are happy.

I hope his sets your mind at ease a little.

Nanette




the following is Jherek's reply:
Hello,

We realize now that we were not ignored by you are Heather. However, given that 2-3 days after the babies were born, the front desk staff was still unaware of their existence, this raises many concerns; who was aware of their existence and caring for them? Who was in charge in your absence? Were you on call? It seems no one capable of dealing with such an important issue was available.

Everyone who has e-mailed you is very aware of their situation and very educated regarding rats and their care. We know how they came into your care, and a staff member informed us that they had been there for one and a half months. Given a rat's gestation period, this makes it physically impossible for Elizabeth to have come into your shelter pregnant. Can you please check and confirm how long these two were at your shelter?

The babies were placed in a high traffic area, entirely inappropriate for a new mother, and this poor choice of location may have contributed to their death. Of course, there is another very possible scenario, and that is that they were accidentally thrown out by staff who was uninformed of the situation and threw them out with bedding; this makes the lack of response even more troubling, as if the situation had been dealt with immediately by whoever was left in charge, perhaps they could have been saved. Were all staff who cared for them in any way aware of the babies?

As for food - I believe you're confusing my e-mail with someone elses. I never said they were on cat food. However, it's clear that they're on a poor quality "rat diet" that is, in reality, a generic seed mix that results in the rats picking and choosing and not getting all the nutrition they require. A cheap lab block costs the same as a cheap seed mix. However, a large donation of lab-quality rat blocks were recently made - why are they not simply being used instead? And while it's great that the staff brings them in fresh vegetables sometimes, that doesn't replace the lack of nutrition from a proper lab block.

As for the pine bedding - rats have such incredibly sensitive respiratory tracts, and the phenols released, which are bad for any animal, act as a natural insecticide, so you can see why this isn't just not "ideal," but unacceptable. Respiratory illnesses are the most common problem in rats, and you are contributing to that problem. You would take a dog away for being tied outside with dirty water and not enough shade - well, placing rats on pine is actively contributing to respiratory illnesses for them. Studies have shown that the phenols will actually destroy cells lining the lungs and trachea, and may even cause cancer within the respiratory tract. Throwing down a few layers of paper towel would be better than this.


We have had many babies born here due to someone else's carelessness and they have been rehomed and are happy.


That's what concerns us even more: that, according to your staff, they were born due to a staff member's carelessness. Then, they were given inadequate care in every regard.


and nanette's subsequent brush off:
I cannot change what happened, perceived or real. I can however, ensure that steps will be taken to provide any rats in our future with improved environment and care.


finally you can see the response from members of the forum by going to this link: viewtopic.php?f=4&t=7376&st=0&sk=t&sd=a


please do not think us just rat nuts. we understand that they are just rats and that not everyone share's our enthusiasm for them. this situation came to our attention because of the rats, but it is not the rats themselves that we have concerns about. rather it is the practices, apathy and apparent mindset of the shelter. with these mindsets and practices going on they are not likely to be limited to just rats. as it is a shelter and supposedly there for the protection and care of the animals we are concerned that things like this have occurred there.

at the end of this we are hoping for at least some answers and assurances that these types of practices and this level of ignorance will not be continued. it is apparent from the curt and dismissive replies of the shelter manager that the situation and all its concerns is being brushed aside and so nothing will change if they are left to their own devices.

we ask you to please look into this serious matter and hopefully find the answers that we cannot. thank you for your time and consideration.

cross posted a link to this thread on BruxnBoggle