Abscess, tumor, cyst or something else?

[violet976]

3 day's ago I found quite a bit of blood when cleaning the cage. Upon examination, I found a decent sized opening on Gizmo's underside. She's been eating & getting around fine, & is now on Baytril & twice daily saline flushes, but I'm just wondering everyone's opinion on what they see. This just doesn't look like a standard abscess to me, and I hadn't noticed anything the week before. I also don't feel much under her skin (checking for a large, internal tumor). It also has never had any smell of infection that I could detect.

Here is the photo set of the progression: http://www.flickr.com/photos/scarletnotion/sets/72157633430444883/with/8723680430/

Day 1: Discovery. A lot of black, assumed it was dried blood & scabbing tissue.

Day 2: Saline Flushes twice a day and start of Baytril. Less black around the edges, but a very spongy looking tissue filled in on the middle area of the opening. Very red & inflamed looking.

Day 3: Saline flushes twice a day & Baytril. Most of the black area around the edges gone, still that same spongy tissue in the middle but it looks a bit drier now in person.

 

[Aida]

I'm sorry, I have no idea what it could be- but it is looking better. Good luck with this nasty little thing! (the sore, that is)

 

[dspch911]

I also have no idea and if I had to guess - from other pics I've seen on this site I would guess an abscess since it seems to be healing, but that would only be a guess. Healing vibes from all of us :heart: :heart:

 

[jorats]

I'll repeat what I said to Melissa on FB.
I've had a few rats with "open" wounds that took forever to heal. At this point, you could go to the vet and get it biopsied or simply keep an eye on it. Make sure it remains clean but I wouldn't keep flushing it anymore. She's on Baytril so that's good.

 

[violet976]

Thanks. I called & found out the biopsy is more than I'd like to do, ideally. My good vet (familiar with rats) wont be back until Monday so that gives us a few more days to watch it, document each day's progress with photos and see what happens until then. If it still looks concerning Monday I'll certainly bring her in, and if the biopsy is needed then we'll bite the bullet there as well. Until then I'll keep her on the Baytril & post photos as I take them in case they ring alarm bells for anyone. :wink2:

 

[Joanne]

That looks so odd to me. I would assume that if she had just cut herself, it could be gaping but you would see the muscle layer underneath the skin. One of my boys cut his belly, but there were no weird protrusions, just a hole that quickly healed in a few days. I suppose the tissue could be internal tissue if this is a deep wound that penetrated the muscle as well as the skin. Or, it could be granulation tissue...or a tumour. I will be interested to see how it progresses. Did you find anything she could have cut herself on?

 

[violet976]

Yes, I've been going over these with Shelagh as well & she was leaning towards a tumor. She said she had a rat who had something that looked similar, and for about 10 months it would just scab over, then open & bleed, then scab over, lather rinse repeat.

The inner tissue is what looks odd to me as well, and what raised my alarm bells slightly. With abscesses, I'm used to seeing photos that look more caved in, but with Gizmo, what you see in the photo looks just about as it does in real life. When I checked her on the second day, it almost looked like the entire middle section was filled in with spongy looking/red/inflamed tissue, not caved in in the slightest. Even looking at the first photos right after it happened, I really never saw any deep hole. It seems like it would have had to be a very shallow injury to still have had fresh, red blood but no gaping hole as expected.

I looked all over the cage & found nothing for an injury to have occurred, and the majority of the blood was all on the hammock. I also found no blood on Merlin to indicate a fight (Gizmo can play rough, but Merlin is not a fighter).

I also palpated around gently and didn't feel anything that seemed to indicate a large, internal tumor, but I can't rule it out of course. Simply hoping to see improvement by Monday, or at least no downturn until then since my vet is out of town.

 

[Joanne]

I guess by Monday you will have formed a pretty good opinion of what it is. I believe that it should be healed over by then if it is just an innocuous injury.

 

[Petunia]

:hugs:
sending healing vibes her way.
I only have experience with abscesses and tumors and that looks more tumor-ish to me than abscess-ish (I just made those terms up :lol: )

but I am guessing there are a lot more skin conditions rats can have, that may be less common.
Praying this one has an easy fix and heals up fast for your girl.

 

[violet976]

Had to sneak another peek tonight. It's strange & doesn't show well in the photo, but it almost looks like the lower portion (the fleshy looking red bit at the bottom & the fleshy bit right above near the middle) is pushed out of the hole somewhat. It almost looks a bit wart-like, just slightly, and slightly protruding out of the opening some. I wish it showed in the photo better, as when I look at it in person it almost looks more dried and kind of separate from the actual wound, if that makes any sense. & in person, the whole red area at the bottom & the fleshy tan bit above it all look like one thing, not separate things like in the photo. (sorry, I suck at explaining things like this)

 

[violet976]

I'm not sure if it matters or not, but if you look through the progression shots she appears to be losing hair around this opening as well. Perhaps just from grooming but perhaps it's related.

 

[Petunia]

I'm not sure if it matters or not, but if you look through the progression shots she appears to be losing hair around this opening as well. Perhaps just from grooming but perhaps it's related.

I noticed that too, and was wondering about it

There are so many skin issues that animals can get that are neither abscesses nor tumors, and this one certainly seems to fit the bill. The red part does look wart-like.

Just did a google search for skin lesions in rats, they can get skin cancer, although one site said it's rare.

I found this on lymphoma, sorry there are pretty graphic photos
http://ratguide.com/health/neoplasia/lymphomas.php

http://ratguide.com/health/figures/lymp ... gure_1.php

EDITED to add, that case history is one of Joanne's rats!! (Jorats)

"Cutaneous— lymphoma to the skin seen as lesions. Can appear as red, crusted areas with hair loss, e.g. mycosis fungoides. May be confused with allergic dermatitis. "


:/

 

[violet976]

thanks Petunia. My hunch is that if that's what it is, it will continue to progress rather than look better/cleaner, so I'm glad I've been taking photos now. I'll be checking her a few times per day & will certainly be on the lookout for anything that points in that nasty direction. So far it's just the one spot I see, but I'll give her a thorough going over tonight to see if there are any others hiding.

 

[Petunia]

:hugs:

and I'll continue to hope and pray it's something simple like a wart or other odd growth that can be treated fast and easy
:heart:

 

[mamarat]

Poor baby, sending healing vibes.

 

[violet976]

Day 4 (morning photos - still on Baytril but no more saline flushes) - Today looks more evenly healed and less wartlike. Perhaps it simply looks less wartlike because the top area is filled in now & it's looks more consistent now. It still all looks like it's protruding out a bit, but not any more than yesterday. I also looked over her skin & didn't notice any other issues anywhere. Still not certain all is well but I don't feel like we're backtracking yet.

 

[Aida]

I think since it's healing, you shouldn't worry too much.

 

[Petunia]

yeh healing seems like a real good sign

 

[violet976]

Day 5: (morning) baytril/no flushes

 

[violet976]

Comparing the photos, I see something new that is concerning to me. If you look between even just yesterday and today's shots, while I thought we *might* be on the track to some slow healing, I'm now noticing some color change on the hairless skin below the opening. I've also noticed that the diagonal strip of darker tissue that was near the bottom of the wound yesterday looks to be more in the middle now, leading me to think that the wound has opened a bit further down the bottom, rather than healing.:

This was yesterday:

& this is today: