UPDATE: Purple Vaginal Opening?? -- Late Onset Megacolon

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MadCatter

Active Member
Joined
Oct 27, 2008
Messages
29
Location
Nebraska, USA
Is it possible for rats to show no signs of megacolon before starting to swell up with late onset megacolon? I've read about failure to thrive and whatnot... but is it possible for a rat to seem normal up until it really starts to set in? I know it can take a few months for it to really show up and start causing problems, but what are the symptoms, aside from swelling of the abdomen - and how long does the actually swelling take?

The reason I ask is because Julia has started getting bigger, but not proportionately. I attributed this to her reaching her 6th month, and probably going through a little growth spurt. A friend from work saw her and asked if she was pregnant... except that it isn't possible for her to be. Any time that she and Sgt Pepper had 'access' to each other during the 'dangerous times' after neutering him, I was holding onto one of the rats firmly in my hands, and they never had an opportunity to run freely with each other....

I'm still thinking it's probably a growth spurt, except that she doesn't feel in proportion. If I hold her up by her armpits, it doesn't jut out like a baseball, but she is extra squishy and her belly hangs out on the sides.

I will get a photo tonight if I can find my camera charger. If somebody has photos of normal girl rat bellies around 5-6 months, or those of late onset megacolon, that would be really helpful. I don't want to worry too much, but I've read that usually with megacolon it's too far advanced by the time owners notice anything, and I don't really want to just shrug it off as normal growth just in case.
 
Is she a high white? Also, I believe her poops would be very soft and stinky with megacolon. She would be in pain as well. Does she zone out and her eyes glaze over for certain periods?
A photo will definitely help. I know for myself a couple of times I thought I had ones such rat but it was just my imagination playing tricks on me. Some bellies really look big when all along it's like you said, a growth spurt.
 
It can show up fast, but they swell up really awkwardly like those wee ones.
What are your worries with Julia? Does she have high-white markings? Was she a small unthrifty baby? Does she have any issues with bowel movements?
 
She is a black hooded with no white on her face anywhere. From reading replies from a couple other forums, I'm leaning away from MC because everyone says the bellies feel firm, and that I should have noticed the inability to thrive. She's been perfectly healthy up to this point, managing to hold dominant rat position over Martha (not Sgt yet though.. he's quite a bit larger than her and has an advantage). I've felt all around in her abdomen and it's squishy with no lumps. She's been extra cuddly recently, and I suppose this could just be her growing up a bit and not being such an exploratory little girl rat anymore. Perhaps having Sgt Pepper in the mix has helped balance out the group a bit, contributing to her calming down, or maybe she's started to bulk up in hopes of being dominant rat ;)

Thank you for all of the replies :)
 
You know, typically late onset MC can mean a few different things. Mostly it can happen from stress or injury, but I have not heard of a case where a rat suddenly gets MC at 6 months old.

I WOULD be more inclined to wonder if the sudden weight gain was hormonal/uterine in nature. Is she spayed? If so, nevermind. :wink: But you might want to check to see if she has any discharge etc. Pyometra can cause bloating and requires a vet appt asap.

Something else to consider is CHF. Their bellies can be come distended from fluid build up.

But at 6 months old, I wonder if she's just getting her hormonal "chub". Seems like right about the time mine have put on weight (spayed or not).
 
I was always under the impression that you get megacolon either as a very young baby or the 'late onset' was when the rat was 2 years old or more. Not 6 months.
 
I was also going to mention that when a baby develops MC, you generally see it around 3-5 weeks of age. They might live to be a few months old, but not without a lot of specialized care. Sadly, they all generally pass away very young.

In our case, Willie (I won't tell the whole story, because I did post it in another thread), he was fine until about 5-6 weeks of age. Although my vet never used the term "late onset", I always kind of thought of Willie's as a form of late onset, since his form was not full blown and he went on to live to be 21 months old (with me having to help him poo everyday of his life) I agree with LA, "late" generally means when they get it at old age.

It's just extremely rare (or maybe even unheard of) to see it suddenly appear at 6 months. Even constipation isn't too common in rats. Although they do get it, you can generally manage it very quickly and get them back on track.
 
Debbie your Willie had a mild form of MC that the babies get. Wonderful to hear that he lived to that lovely old age with your help :thumbup:

but late onset is usually anywhere from 4-10 months of age I believe, where they stop being able to get food through their intestines and bloat up fast like the babies...
from ratguide.com
Late, or delayed, onset megacolon appears to have the same genetic origin as early onset and is seen in the same lines as early onset. It may be a milder form of the disease, but unfortunately it does progress in severity until it becomes lethal. Often the first sign of delayed onset megacolon is shown by the baby rat’s failure to thrive. Gastrointestinal problems may not become apparent until the rat is 2-5 months old. At that time you may see bloating, diarrhea, constipation, or alternating bouts of diarrhea and constipation. Stools passed may be hard, fibrous, foul smelling, dry, oversized, oddly shaped, blunt on the ends, and have blood or mucus in or between them.
Late onset can also be even more delayed, sometimes not becoming symptomatic until the rat has reached a later age of 4-10 months. With no early warning signs of a problem (such as failure to thrive, unusual stools, or chronic diarrhea) the very late onset type may often be too far advanced, by the time the owner notices a problem, to treat.
 
I've finally found my camera battery charger, so by tomorrow morning I should have photos. I've been feeling around in her abdomen (which she doesn't enjoy, but allows), and still haven't found any lumps. Everything is symmetrical, nothing feels out of place, or firm where it doesn't make sense to be firm (like bones). Still squish and no firm belly. Skin and coat are still perfectly smooth, no leaking of fluids, and still no runny poos. Behaviorally the only thing that's different is that she's a little extra cuddly.

She hasn't gotten any bigger that I've noticed, but unfortunately don't have a way to weigh her currently, so I'm just going off of watching her and holding her. She certainly does feel heavier, and it's obvious there is more there to hold on to. The last week or so I have really notice that the food gets eaten MUCH quicker between the three of them (to the point where I've set up another bowl the same size as the first, and they are going through this just as quickly).

You guys don't suppose she's just overeating or eating extra to compensate for extra growth?
 
Finally, some photos :) :

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3104949581_ee8a13cedd.jpg
 
Aw she's beautiful. From my point of view and from the pictures, she doesn't look bloated or anything. Unless she does get a disintended stomach I would say it's not megacolon from those pictures.
 
Thanks again for all the replies :) It's really reassuring! I think I was just a bit caught off guard by how quickly she got 'big'. They've gone through little spurts before, but it's like this is the 'last push to the finish line' so to speak :p
 
I checked on the rats before going to bed, and this is what I found with Julia:

3120427196_9e3a298d32.jpg


The opening to her vagina is purple, and she is also in heat.

I'm more worried now about the weight gain :( Any ideas (pyometra?)? She is still squishy, rather than firm, and there is no tension in her body, but she obviously shouldn't be purple. Behaviorally she was acting normal earlier today, seems to be acting 'normal' for being in heat.

There were two soft (though not runny) poos today when she and Martha were running around in the bathroom while I took a bath. Usually neither of them poos while in the bathroom.

I will call a vet tomorrow and try to get her in.
 
A couple people on goosemoose mentioned that color was normal while in heat. I guess I'm just not sure if it's always been like that when she's in heat, or if I just paid more attention to it because of her recent weight gain. I've essentially ruled out pregnancy at this point simply because the time span of her being large -everywhere I've heard is that they really 'swell up' from pregnancy a day or two before giving birth... not for a full 2 weeks.

If it's normal, then I suppose I could just be being hypersensitive (as normal... I guess that's also better than not noticing that something is wrong with the rats until it's too late).

Part of me still wants to call the vet when they open in an hour, but if this seems normal (and her behavior certainly is) then do you think it would be safe for me to wait a day and see how she is doing/wait until she is out of 'heat' and check on her?
 
Some of my paler coloured does always looked really purple when really full-on in heat. IIRC that only lasts a few hours so you could easily miss it if say, normally asleep when their season is at it's fullest.
I had a doe that that used to have phantom pregnancies regularly. She was never bred from, but it only happened when I had bucks too. She would swell right up and start nesting, then go back down to normal again. The bucks were in a different room and she never had any contact with them.
 
Typical in-heat girly...don't worry about the purple. Very normal for some girls. :) Its just extra blood flow to the area :D

Some are just very open and pink, others are very open and purplish...i have tried to get a pic of that to show people for a long time, but the dang frog hopping girls won't keep their nether regions still enough for me to focus :doh:

This was as good as I got, a girly on her first heat, but she's the pink non-scary variety. :wink2:
babygirlinheat.jpg
 

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