no pets allowed

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pscychopomp

Well-Known Member
Joined
Nov 8, 2009
Messages
368
Location
Toronto
I've been apartment hunting and I'm shocked how many places say no pets allowed. I've seen it mentioned on here that in Ontario a landlord legally can't stop you from having pets? I was wondering how you would go about that though, if you tell them, wouldn't they just not give you the place? If you lie about having pets prior to moving in, is there not consequenes? I also think that if I were to say I have rats, they are going to have very negative thoughts on that, maybe I should say they are hamsters and hope they don't know the difference :) I was also considering fostering cats, until I'd feel ready for my own...I've had pets my entire life, so basically no pets allowed is not going to work for me :p
 
When I rented my first apartment I asked if a small caged animal like a hamster was ok. I figured it was the safest way to ask without actually lying and there wasn't anything in the lease stating I couldn't keep pets either.
 
Legally a landlord cannot refuse an apartment to you because you have pets, or evict you because you have pets, even if (and this is very important) you have signed a lease saying pets are not allowed! In Ontario, any clauses in a lease that are illegal are null and void if it ever came down to fighting it with the landlord and tenancy board. Note, though, not all landlords know this (having rented for the past five years, its shocking how little landlords know sometimes), and some can get around the issue by making up another reason not to rent to you/to evict you (like saying your references didn't pan out, etc).

What I would suggest is look at places and lie/dont bring up the issue. Don't rule out looking at places just because the ad says no pets. Often they really refer to cats and dogs anyway. If you are really serious about a few places, you can do what I did and say that you had one cage of small animals (didn't tell him it was a huge double CN...) or something similar. See what he/she thinks. Even though he cannot refuse to rent to you on that basis, lying is probably not the best way to start out with a new landlord. My landlord was a bit nervous about it, but I said that they were very sweet and never smell, as I clean the cage twice a week. He gave the ok, and it turns out when he met them (when he was checking something in my apartment), he was quite pleased with them, and said they looked cute!

Another route you can go is never bring the issue up at all. Don't be afraid of signing a lease that says no pets, as the clause isn't legally binding anyway. If/when they do find out, you can take it from there. Note though, if they bring it up, I still don't reccommend lying to them, and if they ever try to take action against you, you can show them the landlord and tenancy board laws and calmly suggest that you wouldn't be afraid bringing the issue to their attention.

Sorry for such a long post, its just that I went though this a couple of months ago, and thought I would shed my knowledge. :D
 
This is what I found:


Q6: The landlord says I must either move out or get rid of my pet; Do I?

A6: Only if the pet is dangerous, causes allergic reactions or causes problems for other tenants or the landlord, must you get rid of your pet or consider moving elsewhere as per Landlord application to terminate tenancy based on animals.

Even if you signed a lease with a "no pets" clause, if the pet is not a problem for anybody they can not enforce it; such no pets clauses are invalid under the law.

You do not have to move or get rid of the pet unless the Board issues a written order to do so.


ONTARIO TENANTS RIGHTS: http://www.ontariotenants.ca
 
Ive lived in 3 apartment, all said no pets.. well I just never told the landlord I had pets :D LOL I thought screw you, they arent harming anything.. and they arent allowed in the apartment without 24 hours notice or what not.. so I just hid them when they came in...its too hard to find places that allow animals and I dont want to fight with my right to have the place even though I have a pet.. so I take the low sneeky route..arent I a devil LOL :giggle:
 
Yeah I figure they are not like a dog where they might hear barking etc, there's not really any way of them knowing unless they see me bring in the cages...in fact I'm pretty sure the landlord here doesn't know I have them :p
 
I would look a little more into what the "No Pets" means. Like lizmo1221 said, that usually just means no dogs or cats (free-roaming animals that could potentially damage the property) If you want to ask, just say "small caged pets" so they know that they'll be contained(most of the time :wink: ) and won't likely be able to cause damage, since that's likely what they're concerned with.
 
Agreed. Most places that are no pets refer to dogs and cats, and might let you have small caged animals. However, I also know that some places, like the place I rent from are only supposed to allow 1 pet, even if it is caged, due to some gerbils breaking loose and reproducing, and taking over a complex last year. I simply explained that I have two boys and they were able to make an exception.

Another thing to consider is pet deposits. A lot of places that do allow pets require a pet deposit. However, a lot of them are referring to cats, dogs, and aquariums, not small caged pets, so make sure you are not spending money that you don't have to .

Best of luck with your search, I know this can be challenging.
 
Bamboo said:
I would look a little more into what the "No Pets" means. Like lizmo1221 said, that usually just means no dogs or cats (free-roaming animals that could potentially damage the property) If you want to ask, just say "small caged pets" so they know that they'll be contained(most of the time :wink: ) and won't likely be able to cause damage, since that's likely what they're concerned with.
Click to expand...

The issue also could be noise/smell related. A landlord doesn't want to have to deal with noise complaints from the neighbours because a dog is barking, or complaints from other tenants because the apartment smells like feces. Luckily rats don't make enough noise to cause any complaints, but the smell could be a factor. I would make sure I keep it to a minimum to avoid any issues.

And, if you do choose to keep it a secret from your landlord, make sure any housemates know about them before you move in or they move in. You don't want to make them uncomfortable with a surprise rodent colony in their house, they might complain to the landlord about it and turn it into an issue. I'm not saying that they have to be in love with rats, just that they are informed what is in the house when you or they decide to move in. I live alone in my place, so I never have to deal with this.
 
With regard to leases in Ontario: Some landlords add clauses to their leases that they know will not stand up in a court of law. For instance, in one lease I had, the landlord claimed they were not liable for injury or death even in instances where they were grossly negligent. This lease also stated that pets were not allowed. Sometimes, landlords rely on tenants not knowing their rights so that these violations can be slipped into the lease. The simple fact is, if a clause in a lease runs contrary to the law, that clause is null and void and unenforceable.

So, unless your pet is dangerous or causes problems for others in the building, your landlord cannot, legally, prevent you from having a pet. They also cannot demand a pet deposit. Unfortunately, there's nothing stopping the landlord from finding some other reason to reject your rental application if they're truly determined to keep pets out.
 
Keeping in mind that this doesn't apply to purchased condo situations. A condo association can say "no pets" .. or so I read in an article in the newspaper once upon a time.
 
Man, I wish I lived in Ontario...although, now you mention it, I should look into the actual laws down here. It honestly never occurred to me that a landlord would write illegal things into the lease in faith that nobody would question them. Color me an optimist.

Whenever I've moved into a new place, I've always asked specifically about "small, caged pets" and didn't elaborate on the nature of them. Granted, I also have to live in pet-friendly apartments due to the cat and the dog anyway -- but I've noticed saying "I have one cage of small animals" is way easier to handle for the average person than "I have nine rats."
 
We got lucky with the apartment we found - I first asked about the pet policy (cats okay, small animals/birds okay, dogs... not ideal, basically), then I told her that I had two girl rats (this was back in Princess and Plumeria's days). I explained that they were Emotional Support Animals (so like guide dogs, just for emotions), I had a letter from my social worker explaining the benefit they provided, explained about their cage, my policy on bags of feed (always sealed etc), showed her pictures, and she actually wrote a specific clause in our lease about us being allowed to have rats. Usually when they need to do their annual inspection of the fire alarm and stuff I just throw a blanket over the cage, but I certainly don't hide them - she knows they're there and she's never had a problem with them.

I think it completely depends on who the superintendant/landlord is - some people are nice, some people are mean, some... well, terrible incompetent nincompoops seems to cover them. Our super has at least one bird (fairly noisy) and had a cat (has since passed away), so she's definitely sympathetic to animal lovers, especially those who understand that no apartment is completely noise proof, lol
 
There's really no debate. In Ontario it's illegal to have a "no pets" clause. Period. End of sentence. You don't have to tell the landlord you have pets if you're worried that they're going to be bas***s and keep you from renting. They can't kick you out because it would be against the law. If you are an irresponsible pet owner they have lots of opportunity to kick you out for other reasons - so what's the diff?

A few years ago my daughters landlord tried to evict her for her rats - I think she had about 12 at the time. She took the case to the housing tribunal and they ruled in her favour. They also ruled that the landlord had to repay her for her costs (lost time from work, etc.) and that they were to refrain from harrassing her. She had a strong case though - both the the By-Law Officer and the SPCA wrote letters stating that the pets were not illegal and that they were clean and well cared for.






 
I do not like lying, it would cause me a lot of stress personally. The past two times I have looked for an apartment, I have been very upfront with the landlord on the phone about my rats. Only twice did they say no. I didn't bother fighting it because the place wasn't so nice anyhow. All other times they didn't really care about the pets.
 
I always mention my pets, however I don't say much if I'm getting more.
Yea you could lie or not mention it if they have that "No pets clause" but why start something with your landlord, as a student I have enough to deal with without a landlord breathing down my back and being mean to me because they don't like my pets...

I say it like this to people, "I know that No Pets means nothing in Ontario and they can't evict me or even deny me rent because I have them but they also can't deny me on the basis of race; but if they're a racist and they let me rent what stops my life from being a living hell??"

My advice: Find a nice landlord who's fine with your animals and just be sure to stay on top of the cleanings.
 
MumsyRat said:
There's really no debate. In Ontario it's illegal to have a "no pets" clause. Period. End of sentence. You don't have to tell the landlord you have pets if you're worried that they're going to be bas***s and keep you from renting. They can't kick you out because it would be against the law. If you are an irresponsible pet owner they have lots of opportunity to kick you out for other reasons - so what's the diff?

A few years ago my daughters landlord tried to evict her for her rats - I think she had about 12 at the time. She took the case to the housing tribunal and they ruled in her favour. They also ruled that the landlord had to repay her for her costs (lost time from work, etc.) and that they were to refrain from harrassing her. She had a strong case though - both the the By-Law Officer and the SPCA wrote letters stating that the pets were not illegal and that they were clean and well cared for.
Click to expand...


The problem with the "i have pets deal with it and i dont care if you know/care or not" attitude is that the landlord can find another reason to evict/not rent to you that is legal, as well as very hard to prove (or never give you a reason why they are not renting to you).

You also have to think about the fact that this is the person that you rely on to make repairs to your apartment, or listen to your concerns with any issues you might have (with roomates, etc), and having a bad relationship right off the bat because you stirred up s**t and forced them to rent to you when they didn't want to might make it very difficult for a landlord to take you seriously when it comes to your concerns. I had a situation where my landlord did not like me very much and always sided with my house mate with our many issues (even though he was clearly in the wrong). My policy is to always be up front, just in case they do come in and make a repair, and they find your rats and they flip out, causing similar issues.
 
You guys are lucky, here they can say no pets and if you have a pet and its not in the lease that they are not allowed, they can give you the boot anyways. No matter what the pet is :( Although, Ive never had a problem getting apartments once they meet my dog :)
 

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