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Doddi
Guest
Hi! I am in the process of trying to introduce my 4 male rats to eachother but am having some issues. Sorry for the long post. Here is a little bit about myself first- my name is doddi and I have had over 30 rats, but this is the first time I’ve ever had males. Introing females has always been easy and problem free! This however is all very new to me with males. I feel it’s best to give a bit of background about the boys to help understand the complexity of the issue, so here goes! Please read to the end and if you have any advice i would be very thankful! I will take all the help I can get right now!
Our oldest group of boys are carl and boba. They’re both about 1.5 years and are both dumbo Rex rats. I adopted both of these boys at about 13 weeks of age and they were very timid. Carl is the alpha and is larger. Carl tends to get moody and is extremely territorial. He is very sweet, but is the least friendly rat and is actually very timid. He has issues taste testing our dog, Marley, and sometimes pulls on our skin or clothes and I’m never sure if it’s meant to be aggressive or not. Boba is a bit smaller and more friendly. Boba does not get as moody but both boba and carl don’t like being picked up. Boba is more comfortable out of the cage than carl, and sometimes challenges him. My ex husband adopted a cat despite the fact that we had rats and when we began the divorce I was of course left to care for Sonny the cat. Despite loving him, he did what all cats do and hounded the rats and would try to paw at their cage. Sonny has long been adopted though but sometimes I think that the small amount of exposure carl and boba had to Sonny has accounted for their current timidity- though it is getting better- they now come out of their cage for play time much more easily.
Our second group of boys is pokie and frankie and they have never met a cat. They’re about a year old and were rescued at about 6 months, and are both standard hooded top eared boys. Their previous human hoarded rats and died, and all the rats were stuck in the home for weeks without food or water until they were discovered. Despite all of this, pokie and frankie are some of the friendliest rats I’ve ever had. They are extremely comfortable with humans and extremely adventurous. Pokie is larger and is alpha. He definitely spends most of his out of cage time scent marking. Frankie is our smallest but biggest personality and is so outgoing. Most of his out of cage time is spent playing and exploring.
Our rats have their own room- my boyfriend and I sleep in the living room to ensure that our boys have as much space as they need, so that the master bedroom can be a giant playground for them! When they have out time, we always let carl and boba out first. This is because if we let pokie and frankie out first, carl smells them and gets upset and will actually start hissing and running around trying to cover up the younger boys scent with his own, and will become aggressive. So to avoid this we always let carl and boba out first because we figure it’s the best thing to do. However lately now, pokie, the alpha from the younger pair, has been puffing up when he comes out and smells that the older boys have been out before him. I’m thinking that as he gets older he’s becoming more territorial. boba and frankie don’t ever seem to be bothered by the other rats scents.
We want to introduce both pairs to eachother because we’d eventually like to move them all into the same cage- currently both pairs have their own giant double critter nation so there is definitely enough room to have them all live together. As I said before however, I understand that introing male rats can be difficult and I only have experience introing females.
The first intro took place a couple weeks ago and everything we did was advised via various websites and videos. None of the boys know the bathroom very well so we decided that the bathtub is the most neutral area, and introed all of them at the same time. everything seemed well at first. The bathtub was lined with a soft towel and little chocolate chips, and we had a ladder going up to the top so that they wouldn’t feel stuck in their or backed into a corner. Of course carl seemed upset but kind of just sat there glaring at the younger boys. Boba seemed fine and pokie and frankie were pretty fearless. All of a sudden, boba got overwhelmed when he was trying to climb the latter because pokie and frankie were in his way and he attacked one of them and then ran up my arm and sat on my shoulder seeking safety. In the confusion, pokie and frankie started attacking eachother even though they are already a pair! Boba ended up with a good sized slash on the back of his ear and pokie had a tiny nick on his side. It all happened so fast I’m still not sure who injured who. Carl was untouched but seemed very upset as did boba. Frankie and pokie were of course fine.
Phew. First intro done. Everyone was willing to take a treat after that which I know is a good sign. We wanted to wait for bobas ear to heal before the second intro and in the meantime returned to our daily activities. Today was the second intro but we decided to just introduce the two alphas, carl and pokie, to eachother first. Pokie is now the same size as carl and so we figured we better get the intros over with before pokie severely outgrows everyone and becomes as terrritorial as carl. We lined the bathtub with treats again and at first the intro went great. Carl went up to pokie for a moment and smell him but did not try to get on his back. Pokie actually froze and we realized that pokie was actually really stressed and worried, which was the opposite of what I had predicted. Pokie made his way up the later and stayed on my boyfriends shoulder, hiding. Carl at this time became very comfortable and started eating the treats in the bathtub! That’s really weird for him because he usually won’t eat anything when it’s not in his cage, especially if another rat is around. We decided that since carl was doing so well but pokie was so freaked out that we’d grab frankie to help pokie feel more comfortable. However I have the feeling that while pokie was hiding on my boyfriend, carl was in the process of marking the bathtub as his territory because as soon as we brought Frankie into the bathtub carl became extremely offended and ran up and attacked him. Frankie’s small so I broke up the fight with a gloved hand. Frankie was then running around on my boyfriends lap and carl, clearly agitated, was almost trying to get to him. This was the point that we decided to stop the intro and seek some more advice.
I worry for the safety of all of them as I have read that male rats will fight to the death. Is it best to just let them scuffle? Blood has been drawn so I know that they’re serious fights and now am unsure how to proceed. I am also worrried that now the bathtub isn’t neutral ground anymore and I don’t have another place for intros that’s neutral. Thanks for reading this long thing. Ate advice would be greatly appreciated!
Our oldest group of boys are carl and boba. They’re both about 1.5 years and are both dumbo Rex rats. I adopted both of these boys at about 13 weeks of age and they were very timid. Carl is the alpha and is larger. Carl tends to get moody and is extremely territorial. He is very sweet, but is the least friendly rat and is actually very timid. He has issues taste testing our dog, Marley, and sometimes pulls on our skin or clothes and I’m never sure if it’s meant to be aggressive or not. Boba is a bit smaller and more friendly. Boba does not get as moody but both boba and carl don’t like being picked up. Boba is more comfortable out of the cage than carl, and sometimes challenges him. My ex husband adopted a cat despite the fact that we had rats and when we began the divorce I was of course left to care for Sonny the cat. Despite loving him, he did what all cats do and hounded the rats and would try to paw at their cage. Sonny has long been adopted though but sometimes I think that the small amount of exposure carl and boba had to Sonny has accounted for their current timidity- though it is getting better- they now come out of their cage for play time much more easily.
Our second group of boys is pokie and frankie and they have never met a cat. They’re about a year old and were rescued at about 6 months, and are both standard hooded top eared boys. Their previous human hoarded rats and died, and all the rats were stuck in the home for weeks without food or water until they were discovered. Despite all of this, pokie and frankie are some of the friendliest rats I’ve ever had. They are extremely comfortable with humans and extremely adventurous. Pokie is larger and is alpha. He definitely spends most of his out of cage time scent marking. Frankie is our smallest but biggest personality and is so outgoing. Most of his out of cage time is spent playing and exploring.
Our rats have their own room- my boyfriend and I sleep in the living room to ensure that our boys have as much space as they need, so that the master bedroom can be a giant playground for them! When they have out time, we always let carl and boba out first. This is because if we let pokie and frankie out first, carl smells them and gets upset and will actually start hissing and running around trying to cover up the younger boys scent with his own, and will become aggressive. So to avoid this we always let carl and boba out first because we figure it’s the best thing to do. However lately now, pokie, the alpha from the younger pair, has been puffing up when he comes out and smells that the older boys have been out before him. I’m thinking that as he gets older he’s becoming more territorial. boba and frankie don’t ever seem to be bothered by the other rats scents.
We want to introduce both pairs to eachother because we’d eventually like to move them all into the same cage- currently both pairs have their own giant double critter nation so there is definitely enough room to have them all live together. As I said before however, I understand that introing male rats can be difficult and I only have experience introing females.
The first intro took place a couple weeks ago and everything we did was advised via various websites and videos. None of the boys know the bathroom very well so we decided that the bathtub is the most neutral area, and introed all of them at the same time. everything seemed well at first. The bathtub was lined with a soft towel and little chocolate chips, and we had a ladder going up to the top so that they wouldn’t feel stuck in their or backed into a corner. Of course carl seemed upset but kind of just sat there glaring at the younger boys. Boba seemed fine and pokie and frankie were pretty fearless. All of a sudden, boba got overwhelmed when he was trying to climb the latter because pokie and frankie were in his way and he attacked one of them and then ran up my arm and sat on my shoulder seeking safety. In the confusion, pokie and frankie started attacking eachother even though they are already a pair! Boba ended up with a good sized slash on the back of his ear and pokie had a tiny nick on his side. It all happened so fast I’m still not sure who injured who. Carl was untouched but seemed very upset as did boba. Frankie and pokie were of course fine.
Phew. First intro done. Everyone was willing to take a treat after that which I know is a good sign. We wanted to wait for bobas ear to heal before the second intro and in the meantime returned to our daily activities. Today was the second intro but we decided to just introduce the two alphas, carl and pokie, to eachother first. Pokie is now the same size as carl and so we figured we better get the intros over with before pokie severely outgrows everyone and becomes as terrritorial as carl. We lined the bathtub with treats again and at first the intro went great. Carl went up to pokie for a moment and smell him but did not try to get on his back. Pokie actually froze and we realized that pokie was actually really stressed and worried, which was the opposite of what I had predicted. Pokie made his way up the later and stayed on my boyfriends shoulder, hiding. Carl at this time became very comfortable and started eating the treats in the bathtub! That’s really weird for him because he usually won’t eat anything when it’s not in his cage, especially if another rat is around. We decided that since carl was doing so well but pokie was so freaked out that we’d grab frankie to help pokie feel more comfortable. However I have the feeling that while pokie was hiding on my boyfriend, carl was in the process of marking the bathtub as his territory because as soon as we brought Frankie into the bathtub carl became extremely offended and ran up and attacked him. Frankie’s small so I broke up the fight with a gloved hand. Frankie was then running around on my boyfriends lap and carl, clearly agitated, was almost trying to get to him. This was the point that we decided to stop the intro and seek some more advice.
I worry for the safety of all of them as I have read that male rats will fight to the death. Is it best to just let them scuffle? Blood has been drawn so I know that they’re serious fights and now am unsure how to proceed. I am also worrried that now the bathtub isn’t neutral ground anymore and I don’t have another place for intros that’s neutral. Thanks for reading this long thing. Ate advice would be greatly appreciated!
