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Bundyrats

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 20, 2011
Messages
1,135
Location
Bundaberg Australia
Oh God, what have I done. I had Sheba booked in at the vet today thinking I would have to have her PTS but last night and this morning she seemed ok, so I changed my mind (see my recent post No Diagnosis. Desperate!). I went to the vet (about 3.5 hours ago) and he said we can try one last thing because Jorats you mentioned a bladder infection and so I put that to the vet, I now have her on Metcam injections twice per day for a day and a half and then daily for 5 days and also Bactrim twice daily. But when I got home, I noticed there were two large dobs of pee full of blood on the bottom of the cage. I didn't even see it when I got home to take her to the vet because she was on the top floor and the blood was on the bottom. I have two other rats, but I know it has to be hers. *I want to curse right now* but heck what kind of pain or agony is she in? I can't believe I missed it. I am past the point of telling if I am just being selfish wanting to keep her going a bit longer but I swear I thought she was still coping this morning. WHAT DO I DO? The vet gave her a good dose of fluids under the skin to keep her hydrated on the metcam tonight, but is blood in pee painful? The vet's are open tomorrow (Saturday) but it's not my normal vet and I really only wanted him to tend to her if I have to make THAT decision. How long should I wait to see if the antibiotics work? I will do anything for my girl but I won't let her suffer. She's just laying there, with porph all over her face, this is heart-breaking. I feel sick.
 
Sorry, so my whole point is that I went to the vet appointment anyway but now I am wondering if I should have just put her out of her misery or not. And I did a search on 'blood in urine' on the rat shack and it's no surprise that this is super serious. I just don't want her to be in pain. I want to give the antibiotics a chance to work but not if it means she's in agony.
 
You can tell if she is in pain by a few things. If they are having pain in their abdomen you will see owie stretches. Their body gets distorted looking. She may chew on things, like towels bedding and litter. She may also brux with pain. rats seem to have a high pain level tolerance. I personally would give it a few doses to work that would all depend on the blood too. Is it a lot of blood? and have you checked her female parts to make sure she is not bleeding from her vaginal opening? The metacam will help with the pain.

It is hard to watch or debate if you made the right choice. I fought that for two week with 2 of my girls. Just watch her closely If you have doubts put her in a separate carrier with a light color fabric then you can see is she is bleeding or how much. I find if you want to check pee the best thing to do is wake them up then put them in a carrier on light colored fabric.


I am sure someone with experience with UTI's will come along I can only help with the pain part I am not familiar with UTI's at all. I hope she starts feeling better.
 
blood in urine is usually a urinary tract infection which the bactrim should take care of...not too serious. IF the blood is from her vagina then you have a much more serious thing going on but since you find it in the pee, its a good thing :thumbup:

The metacam injections DO worry me...I am surprised they didn't give you oral and metacam is to be given once a day.

What concentration is your metacam, how much are you supposed to be giving and how much approx does your rat weigh?
 
oh gosh, so good to hear from someone. It's night time here so I was waiting for the other side of the world to wake up. Hopefloats, it doesn't seem that there is any pain as per your things to look for. But she is just so limp, there no quality of life there. Could it simply be a URI and we've missed it? She was on Baytril a couple of weeks ago and it did nothing so the vet assumed it was not an infection but I was researching on the rat shack and read that if I feed Baytril with Ensure it can be less effective so perhaps that is why there was not much improvement??? Because all she's had for 3-4 weeks is Ensure mixed with soy baby food. lilspaz, the blood is definately in her pee because she did a pee on a light coloured blanket and it was stained. I haven't tipped her upside down yet to look at her 'bits' because she is still recovering from her trip to the vet (fluid injections, met cam injection, Bactim force fed). I am giving her 0.05ml of Metcam. I don't have the concentration but she weighs 290grams. I have been starting to say goodbye to her but what do you reckon, should there be an improvement in the morning from the Bactim? How long do I wait for the Bactim to work, she's been quite sick for a few weeks now, so if it is a URI it would be quite severe now. My vet still thinks its a liver problem....
thanks so mch for your replies
 
Bundyrats said:
oh gosh, so good to hear from someone. It's night time here so I was waiting for the other side of the world to wake up. Hopefloats, it doesn't seem that there is any pain as per your things to look for. But she is just so limp, there no quality of life there. Could it simply be a URI and we've missed it? She was on Baytril a couple of weeks ago and it did nothing so the vet assumed it was not an infection but I was researching on the rat shack and read that if I feed Baytril with Ensure it can be less effective so perhaps that is why there was not much improvement??? Because all she's had for 3-4 weeks is Ensure mixed with soy baby food. lilspaz, the blood is definately in her pee because she did a pee on a light coloured blanket and it was stained. I haven't tipped her upside down yet to look at her 'bits' because she is still recovering from her trip to the vet (fluid injections, met cam injection, Bactim force fed). I am giving her 0.05ml of Metcam. I don't have the concentration but she weighs 290grams. I have been starting to say goodbye to her but what do you reckon, should there be an improvement in the morning from the Bactim? How long do I wait for the Bactim to work, she's been quite sick for a few weeks now, so if it is a URI it would be quite severe now. My vet still thinks its a liver problem....
thanks so mch for your replies
Click to expand...

What concentration is the injectable metacam? I'll have to google it and see, I have never had injectable unless my vet gave it during surgery.
Bactrim/Septra is excellent for UTI's and you should notice an improvement in 3-4 days. The pain from UTI's (ever had one) makes anyone limp and not feel well. In some boys it can actually paralyse their hind end (Malcolm). Mal was put on abs and improved very quickly along with oral metacam for pain and inflammation for a few days.
 
OK looks like 5 mg/ml

ratguide recommends

0.2 mg/kg , PO or SQ, once daily. 27

or

0.5 mg/kg , PO or SQ , daily. 26

or

1.0 mg/kg , PO or SQ , daily. 5 17

or

1.0 mg/kg to 2.0 mg/kg , PO or SQ 26:Analgesic

So say we use 1 mg/kg or even .5 mg/kg

I would give the metacam dosage just once daily, its very effective for 24 hours.
 
Yes, I do think that is what the vet wrote up on the board. 1.0mg/kg, so for 290g he said 0.05ml...but that couln't be right. I should be giving her 0.29ml, shouldn't I?
lilspaz you've given me hope again and yes I've had a URI but could it be going on for this long (3-4 weeks)? And any ideas why the Baytril did not work work? I am concerened that I don't have 3-4 days to wait. She has practically stopped eating just today :(
 
Bladder infections are common enough and blood in the urine is usually our only indicator that something is up.
She should start to perk up soon enough. Her listless could be the pain. Keep up her bactrim... you should see a difference soon enough.
 
Ok, I am trying to feed her, it's like she wants to eat but then turns away and wipes her face along the ground.
Here is a pic of her right now. I have a couple of videos but they are like 57 & 94MB, so I have no idea how to get them onto this post.

Ok, so I've tried to post a pic but after 10mins it's still downloading after resizing..?

Anyway, do you really think it could be a UTI even though I have only noticed the blood today (I would have noticed it before if it was there) and she has been off for 4 weeks?
 
It can most definitely still be a UTI. Rats don't always show their symptoms right away, so it could be a week before you ever picked up that something was wrong. Also, UTI's progress to the point of blood in their urine. It's not all of a sudden they have the infection and then there's blood.

The metacam will help her with pain and inflammation, so she should start to perk up some. The Bactrim will start killing off the bacteria as well. Give it atleast 3-4 days to see improvement. I know it's hard seeing her like that, but you have to give the abs time to work. The Baytril may have just not been the right ab for the job.

What all are you trying to feed her? I normally crush up lab blocks or use baby cereal and mix that with strawberry Ensure for my sickies.
 
Yeah, UTIs can start slow and progress to you seeing blood.. she most likely had blood in her urine before now but it would not have been visible without a microscope. My vet told me this morning that Quita did have a bit of blood in her urine even though I could not see any.

Being a multiple UTI survivor, I can say with absolute certainty that a UTI can cause everything you've been worried about. I had one that progressed into my kidneys that was especially horrendous, and if she's been sick for a few weeks, it could have reached that point for her so she'd be feeling really realllllly crummy now.
 
Oh thank you thank you for your replies. Javakittie, it's just that she has been really off for 3 weeks now so that's a long time. I am feeding her soy baby cereal mixed with ensure and it's all she's eaten for the whole three weeks (plus a bit of yogurt and the odd bite of lettuce). But now I am worried that she's not eating - she had about 4.0ml yesterday (usually she was having 20-28ml plus yoghurt) but she just had 1.0ml of food mix - I am overjoyed. If she can just keep eating maybe she will survive.
Moon, thanks for the info.
So you guys understand when I am saying how bad she is right? She's just laying there not doing anything, struggling it seems, to....well just live. But her coat still looks good and she's responds when I am there but just doesn't do anything. Wish I could have posted that video.
 
She just had another 0.3ml. My main question is why didn't the Baytril work two weeks ago? My vet seems to think that should cover most things and even if it didn't, it would slightly improve things but she didn't get better at all....infact she seemed to get a bit better when I took her OFF it.
 
Specific antibiotics are effective on certain types of bacteria. She probably has an infection that is not susceptible to that particular antibiotic.
 
Bundyrats said:
She just had another 0.3ml. My main question is why didn't the Baytril work two weeks ago? My vet seems to think that should cover most things and even if it didn't, it would slightly improve things but she didn't get better at all....infact she seemed to get a bit better when I took her OFF it.
Click to expand...

Bindi my girl had a little abscess/lump they got sick, and in the few days she was on the meds, it swelled 4 times it's original size. I took her off of it, gone in a few days. I think rats are like people they may react different to some meds and sometimes it might not be the right med for the bacteria.

When rats are sick they will lay around, it doesnt always mean they are on their deathbed just really ill. It is hard line to figure out but trust your instincts. She may just need the rest to heal up.
 
All bacteria is sensitive to different meds. I remember once trying 4 different meds before we found something that helped with my girls bladder infection.
 
The vet said to give 0.25ml Bactrim but I am giving her 0.28ml. I just want to get it into her. Hope this will not be bad for her.
Not sure if it's my imagination but I think she might be a little better, she's only had two doses so far though.
 

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