Best 10 minute speech I have ever heard!

[MumsyRat]

Please take 10 minutes and listen/watch this speech by Philip Wollen, former VP of Citibank. IMO, if it does not open your heart and mind, you don't have one.

Pro & Con Debate for Animal Welfare ← Link

"Watch this 10-minute excerpt of Philip Wollen’s speech to the St James Ethics Centre and the Wheeler Centre debate in Australia on May 16, 2012. The larger debate consists of six speakers, three that make the case for getting animals off of the menu and three that make the case against it. Wollen is a former VP of Citibank and Australian philanthropist who is known to keep out of the limelight. But, man, did he come to the table for this debate to deliver a huge performance and a powerful message. Bravo!"

 

[SQ]

WOW !!!!
Thank you for sharing this.

 

[hprats]

Thank you for sharing this...I'm watching the whole debate now.

I kind of disagree about the effectiveness of the speech you shared. He comes off very extreme, and I think that attitude can be off-putting for people who disagree with him.

I'm vegan, and I definitely agree with everything he said, but he didn't give much evidence, more inflammatory language. The man who spoke first for his side provided numbers and cited studies.

I didn't like the way Wollen equated animals to humans, both with the thing about his dad's death and the thing about animal rights being the biggest social justice problem we have (and that I definitely disagree with). I think that attitude makes vegetarians seem like unrealistic extremists, and draws a big line between us and them...a lot of people don't believe that animals are equal to humans (and I don't), and that belief isn't necessary for the success of pro-vegetarian arguments, and it just gives non-vegetarians an excuse to see the argument as fallacious, unrealistic and overly extreme.

He also compared slauterhouses to gulags and eating animals to slavery, which a lot of people are going to find offensive. You can't convince someone to agree with you by offending them.

If I were going to share a video with someone who isn't vegetarian, I wouldn't pick the one you shared here. I don't think they would react positively to it. I think they would kind of roll their eyes, not because they don't have hearts, but because the basis for the man's very inflammatory statements isn't provided in the video.

 

[jorats]

As a meat eater, that video did force me to think and weep, but then I'm a guilty meat eater with a huge heart for animals. Many are not.
I do hope we can make a change.

 

[hprats]

^That's great then . It's really not that hard to give up meat, if you're so inclined. Honestly, it's kind of like quitting smoking. It's hard at first, then it gets easier, but then you start to miss it more again, but then that passes and you can't imagine how or why you'd do it.

It's not super easy though, to do it right, it does help to read some books on nutrition and recipes. I made several failed attempts and veganism without reading a single cookbook, and each time it was a fiasco...I ended up feeling like there was nothing I could eat, and my first few years of being vegetarian were spent living on pasta and yogurt. I don't like to spend a lot of time cooking though, so a lot of the vegan recipes I've read are things I'll never try, but it helps to get ideas for ingredients and ways to put together meals and stuff. It also helps to pick delicious foods from other cultures.

My boyfriend isn't a guilty-feeling meat eater, so it was more him I was thinking about...he was not impressed by his speech, haha. Honestly, I wish there was some way I could make him see it the way I do...he mostly eats vegetarian/vegan, but when we go out, he often orders something with meat.

 

[Joanne]

I am not a vegetarian. I would, however, like to see that the animals we raise to eat are allowed to live 'free range', and are slaughered humanely, ideally on the farm where they were raised. Animals eat animals, and I am an animal. I am an omnivore; omni = all, everything. I think we do eat entirely too much meat. Even comparing the amount of meat people eat in Europe compared to North America speaks volumes. What we eat as one steak per person, would feed an entire family in Europe. It would be interesting to compare rates of certain types of cancer in Europe vs. North America to see if there is a difference linked to diet. But I digress...
I don't think you can ever eliminate animals from the menu. I do think we can change the way we treat these animals, and certainly reduce the amount of meat we eat.

 

[SQ]

Hundreds of millions of people have eliminated meat and animal by products from their diet so we can if we decide to.
And we will be much healthier if we do.
I do not think there is any way to humanely kill someone and be able to safely eat their dead body .... so even if all the other forms of animal cruelty and torture were done away with, the pain and suffering involved in being killed would still be left.
(Check out the talk on backyard chickens)
I'm not vegan or even vegetarian, but i am working on it ...
and I don't like eating anyones dead decaying body (ie meat, chicken, fish) ... too much guilt etc

 

[jorats]

I am not a vegetarian. I would, however, like to see that the animals we raise to eat are allowed to live 'free range', and are slaughered humanely, ideally on the farm where they were raised. Animals eat animals, and I am an animal. I am an omnivore; omni = all, everything. I think we do eat entirely too much meat. Even comparing the amount of meat people eat in Europe compared to North America speaks volumes. What we eat as one steak per person, would feed an entire family in Europe. It would be interesting to compare rates of certain types of cancer in Europe vs. North America to see if there is a difference linked to diet. But I digress...
I don't think you can ever eliminate animals from the menu. I do think we can change the way we treat these animals, and certainly reduce the amount of meat we eat.

I agree with this completely.

 

[jorats]

It's not super easy though, to do it right, it does help to read some books on nutrition and recipes. I made several failed attempts and veganism without reading a single cookbook, and each time it was a fiasco...I ended up feeling like there was nothing I could eat, and my first few years of being vegetarian were spent living on pasta and yogurt. I don't like to spend a lot of time cooking though, so a lot of the vegan recipes I've read are things I'll never try, but it helps to get ideas for ingredients and ways to put together meals and stuff. It also helps to pick delicious foods from other cultures.

And that's my problem. I hate cooking and I'm a very picky eater. I don't like most flavours. I don't like most spices and I don't like almost all legumes that I have tried. I'd be a very unhealthy vegetarian/vegan.

 

[EDK]

Honestly I did weep, i'm against whale hunting, I don't like how we slaughter cattle for meat. I am an animal lover and don't believe in eating horses or deer, cats or dogs and certain birds. But I admit, I'm an oprotunistic ominvor, I eat my veggies and fruits and wheats, but if there's fish/crab/shirmp, chicken, turkey, ham and rarely steak I will eat those too. I love food and I love to experiment in flavors, but that doesn't mean we have to make the animals suffer for our own wants. I say that clearly, 'WANTS' to eat meat is a want, not a need. If it were a forced on habit, I would become a vegetarian, it's a healthier life style on myself and the animals, but I know even if I were a vegatarian, it wouldn't stop others from eating meat as well. That said, there should still be better ways to this problem. Mostly though I'm biggly against Whale Hunting, I watch those band of protesters known as the Sea Shepards (you can view their journey on the Animal Planet Channel), who risk their lives to stop the Japenese whaling fleet from hunting and killing whales exactly as this speaker says...It's horrible to witness, and to me, whales, dolphines and their realitives are just like us. You know they are the only animal other then primates that have sex for pleasure? Or stay in groups as a family, they have their own language, they commit acts of heroism upon themselves and even on us, and they can be murderous just as us for their own personal benefits, killing a baby for instance so they can mate the mother, or kidnap a baby or a female cause they are jealous. They are just like us...to eat them i find is nearly if not exactly an act of canabblism.

 

[hprats]

jorats: fair enough...everyone knows what they can handle. I'm actually extremely picky myself...it's something I'm known for among friends and family, because the list of things I won't eat is huge. I'm really sensitive to textures though, not so much flavours (except sushi...I can't stand any kind of sushi). It doesn't mean you couldn't be a healthy vegetarian (or mostly vegetarian) though. There are a lot of ways to get protein though, and most people eliminating meat don't even need to add any substitutes to make sure they get enough protein...pretty much every food has some protein, and eggs and dairy products have a lot. Personally, I love hummus, chickpeas, and tofu, so I eat a lot of them, but there are other options too.

And reducing meat helps a lot too. Just taking one day of the week to try meatless meals (meatless monday is a thing, right?), then you might find it expanding from there.

I don't know, the way I see it, everyone has to learn how to feed themselves in a way that is balanced and nourishing, not just vegetarians. I don't think it's any easier to eat a healthy diet with meat than a vegetarian one (for me it would be a lot harder!), it's just a matter of what you're used to and what you know. We get into patterns with food, of eating particular staples, and it's just a matter of finding new things you love.

I mean, I'm not saying I think anyone has to be vegetarian. It's all a matter of personal choice, but I think people dismiss it as being overly hard too quickly, because it's just like breaking any other habit. It's not a hard thing to do, but it can be hard to actually make the change...but it also is something that can be done gradually, to make it less of a dramatic switch.

but I know even if I were a vegatarian, it wouldn't stop others from eating meat as well.

True. But the more people become vegetarian, the easier it becomes for others to make the switch too. When I first became vegetarian 13 years ago, it was much, much harder. Restaurants that had vegetarian options were uncommon. Now I can go to almost any restaurant and find something to eat. Major supermarkets carry all kinds of vegetarian and vegan foods which used to be available only through specialty stores, and the number of brands offering vegetarian products keeps growing. The reason for this is because of more and more individuals becoming vegetarian, and so there are more companies that are catering to that.

 

[Joanne]

And reducing meat helps a lot too. Just taking one day of the week to try meatless meals (meatless monday is a thing, right?), then you might find it expanding from there.

I think many of us do eat vegetarian meals, even though we are not vegetarians. I eat nachos with no meat, and quesadillas (it's the cheese and sour cream!), the Greek Vegetarian Plate at my local pizza joint, cauliflower with ranch dressing and cheddar cheese, etc.....all totally yummy! However, if I had to go vegan, I would have to shoot myself. I just can't live without cheese!!!!!

 

[jorats]

My son's girlfriend is now vegetarian so when she comes over for dinners, I make everyone eat a vegetarian meal. We now have meatless Saturday dinners. At first the men in my family complained but too bad.
It's a first step. I'm trying real hard to not buy a lot of meat. If I lived on my own. I'd be a vegetarian, no problem cause I don't mind eating the same thing everyday, would it be balanced... I don't know. Although, I have just found a wonderful product at Superstore, it's call vegetarian ground crumble. You can easily add it to any meal.

 

[Aida]

And reducing meat helps a lot too. Just taking one day of the week to try meatless meals (meatless monday is a thing, right?), then you might find it expanding from there.

That's friday for catholics, Joanne! :wink2:

And yeah, I love veggies more than I love any meat! But I think the problem is that many of us either live with families, and it's one thing to be vegan yourself, and another to pull your whole family with you. I know this would make it so much more difficult, not only because some family members might be against it, but because cooking vegetables or grains or tofu or whatever so that EVERYONE likes the taste must be really hard. I think a lot of people that tried would just eventually run into this wall and start adding tons of things like salt or oil to better the taste, and thus just start eating really unhealthy food. Most kids despise brocolli, but they all love cheetos. Both don't have meat.

Also, tons of cultures have long time traditions of certain meat, many cultures have diets made up entirely of meat, and food brings back memories. And meat is a natural part of our diet. It provides huge amounts of zinc, protein, iron, and vitamin B. Sure, we can find these in other things, but I don't think a lot of people would be very good at lookign for and balancing it out. And disliking one veggie or fruit that has a lot could mean our body would have to little.
It shouldn't be devoured as the main portion of all our meals like it is today, though. The new guidelines from gov. health advisers is 500 grams a week. That's about 3 slices of ham a day, with differences between red and white meat. I think a lot of people go way over that.

I think the much much better way out is to advise people of the animal cruelty, of the health issues of eating too much(but also positives of eating enough) meat, and of how unhealthy most meat is today. This is already happening.

 

[Aida]

Oh, also, I want to share this link:
http://www.peta.org/living/beauty-and-p ... fault.aspx

You can go on there, type in a product you're going out to buy, and it'll show you witch brand to get so you support not testing on animals.

I was amazed to find that most of the big companies are causing cruelty. I mean, you'd think Chanel, L'oreal(or however you spell that), and Johnson N' Johnson would have made enough money by now to pay up a tiny bit extra and be a little bit more ecofriendly. >:I

 

[SQ]

thanks for the info!