A few babies dead - help needed

[SQ]

I have been in contact with a woman who has an pet store surprise litter.
Anyway, just got an email saying that they had separated mom and babies as the mom had killed some of them.
As far as I know, this happened in the last week between approx. 3.5 and 4.5 weeks of age. Mom is a black self so not a high white (thought babies might be ill)
They have no idea who the dad was ...

So, why would a mom kill babies that old :?:

- too crowded of a cage :?:

Ideas anyone ...

 

[jorats]

Oh god, that must have been a horrible sight to take in.
I have no idea why mom would do that. This is something for the experienced breeders to answer.

 

[SQ]

I'm going to email the woman and ask how she knows the mom killed the babies ...
maybe they died and she found mom cleaning up, ie disposing of the bodies ...

any ideas appreciated ...

edited: just heard back and they think the mother killed the babies because they saw them eating a body.

 

[jess111rocks]

knowing pet stores its proubly overcrouded cage are maybe it had something to do with the father not being there

 

[jorats]

edited: just heard back and they think the mother killed the babies because they saw them eating one a body.

Ok... so it may not be mom that killed them. They might have been very sick rats and mom was cleaning up.

 

[SQ]

Sorry for the misunderstanding ...
These rats are not at a pet store.
A "pet store surprise litter" is what we call it when someone buys a female rat from a pet store and later they discover that she was pregnant because she has a litter of babies.

In this case, two days after the people bought the girl, she had a litter of babies.

I just don't understand what could have happened to them at that age.

It is important because they are almost old enough to start being adopted out ... not a good idea if there might be something wrong with the remaining babies.

Any ideas??

 

[lilspaz68]

Nature takes her course is what I would say. As sad as it is, the babies that survive are the "healthy" ones.

You have no idea of knowing what issues mom faced, what "insults" those babies recieved as embyro's in utero...but the ones who are still alive and make it to weaning, should be fine.

 

[jorats]

Are the remaining babies thriving? They would need to be fed a very good diet for growing pups.

 

[SQ]

The people separated the babies from their mom when this happened.
So I guess they have been weaned
As far as I know, babies are about 4.5 weeks old.
I emailed them with suggestions for food but I have no idea what they are being fed or how they are doing.

Thanks for your ideas ...

 

[user 78]

Mother may not be high white [showing] but the father may have been, and it would depend on the markings of the babies. If I remember correctly, many patterns of coats can carry high white, but the ones who show who are at the most danger.

Since this started happening right about weaning time, MC would be an idea. The pups would have already been sampling mom's food in the cage, I think. It could be any number of organ failures, though, if there weren't any direct symptoms presenting. Did the babies bloat up or anything really significant? Did the owner say anything about what may have happened just prior to them finding mom cleaning up?

As Shelagh said, there's no way of knowing what happened to those bubs in utero, what diseases or malfunctions could be going on. So very sad.

 

[SQ]

I emailed the woman back yesterday, made a few suggestions, let her know it was unlikely that mom had killed the babies given their age, and asked a couple of questions.
Haven't heard back from her yet ...

If/When I do, I will ask about bloating etc. before the few babies died.

thanks

 

[lilspaz68]

poor babies. I hope they get back to you.

 

[SQ]

In a previous email, I was told that the babies are
white, beige and white, black, and black with a bit of white (black berks?)

Hopefully I will hear back soon ...

 

[SQ]

Received an email today ...
Two more of the babies died before they were separated from the mom.
None have died since being taken away from their mom.
Don't have any more info. and don't think I will be getting any more ...

 

[lilspaz68]

Received an email today ...
Two more of the babies died before they were separated from the mom.
None have died since being taken away from their mom.
Don't have any more info. and don't think I will be getting any more ...

I am sorry to hear this Holly.

 

[jorats]

I wonder if mom's milk might be the problem?