New cage and when can i introduce a second, new rat?

[RemyMyRattie123]

I have one 4 month old male rat, he currently lives in a 20 gallon aquarium. I made the mistake of only getting one rat in the beginning so tomorrow i am buying a Double Critter Nation and then i want to buy a second rat. Do i get my current rat used to his new cage first before introducing him to the new rat? Or do i get my current rat used to the new rat before moving into a new cage? I am planning to have them both in the new critter nation. When do i move them in together? Thank you so much for any advice you can give me.

 

[Damnion]

I would put them both in the new cage at the same time so they are in a neutral space when meeting. Neither one will have his "territory" marked.

 

[Petunia]

is that your rat in the profile photo?
he's adorable
<3

 

[RatsDrawBlood]

Adult males are often more likely to accept young rats than grown, but they must be at least eight or better ten weeks to defend themselves. If someone has a litter, you can put them together to see which he gets along with, or at least can tell you which has a personality likely to inspire your rat to get along with him. I just finished doing precisely what you describe with my 1st two (but females).

When do i move them in together?

Various sites give intro methods (telling how to have the best chances of getting them to be able to live together), but disagreed with each other so I read stuff & did what seemed best as I went. Joinrats.com is the best site for all things behavior, you'll find there an answer to your other question of when do you move them in together.

Do i get my current rat used to his new cage first before introducing him to the new rat?

Nope. The value of the cage being new is that it'll be new to them both when they're 1st in it. Intro methods talk about cleaning a cage well (plus rearranging it) to make it neutral territory when at the point you're to start having them live together, but new is even more neutral, so you can take advantage of that, after doing enough short intros as directed by the intro method you choose.

do i get my current rat used to the new rat before moving into a new cage?

Some even say to have the new rat living in the new cage till he's marked it up as his, as a way of giving david a slingshot to use against goliath, but I found I needed to give my david only the type of slingshot that my goliath would respect the power of, not clobber in order to steal the power of!
Some even had them 1st trade cages to get used to each other's smell, but others say this & other drawn out methods just stress/agitate them further.
At one point I sectioned off a quarter of the CN with see-through plastic & sniff-holes, but as some point out, even just a cage being too big can allow them to set up territories, bad for obvious reasons. Yet someone posted that smaller than a DCN is abuse!
It's tricky but an adventure to say the least.

 

[SQ]

Since your boy is over 12 weeks old, you will need to slowly and gradually intro him to at least one other boy (or spayed girl(s) ). For info on intros see https://www.ratshackforum.com/threa...ps-used-when-putting-new-rats-together.32368/ and joinrats.com

If you already have another cage for the new rat(s), that would be good, because after gradual intros, you can add them both to the CN cage together.

Putting him in with a litter will not really give you good info and rats might get injured
New rats will need to be at least 8 weeks old - 10 weeks is safer, before physical intros

good luck

 

[RatsDrawBlood]

Putting him in with a litter

Yeah don't put him with more than one rat at a time! Here's where putting her in with a litter one rat at a time was suggested to me (though I never did it for fear of injuries):

Hey, personalities are more important than age - you could take your girl to the pet lover's place and let her meet some girls 1-on-1 and let Her choose her friend!
I've done that, the guy brought about 8 girls, I put them with Sunny 1-by-1, she wasn't immediately thrilled with some but she let Sirocco eat out of her bowl, was a no-brainer then!

 

[RemyMyRattie123]

is that your rat in the profile photo?
he's adorable
<3

Thank you I love him so much!

 

[RemyMyRattie123]

Yeah don't put him with more than one rat at a time! Here's where it was suggested to me (though I never did it for fear of injuries):

Thank you so much
I don't think I'm planning to get more than 2 rats at a time but that could change.

 

[RemyMyRattie123]

Since your boy is over 12 weeks old, you will need to slowly and gradually intro him to at least one other boy (or spayed girl(s) ). For info on intros see https://www.ratshackforum.com/threa...ps-used-when-putting-new-rats-together.32368/ and joinrats.com

If you already have another cage for the new rat(s), that would be good, because after gradual intros, you can add them both to the CN cage together.

Putting him in with a litter will not really give you good info and rats might get injured
New rats will need to be at least 8 weeks old - 10 weeks is safer, before physical intros

good luck

Thank you

 

[RemyMyRattie123]

Adult males are often more likely to accept young rats than grown, but they must be at least eight or better ten weeks to defend themselves. If someone has a litter, you can put them together to see which he gets along with, or at least can tell you which has a personality likely to inspire your rat to get along with him. I just finished doing precisely what you describe with my 1st two (but females).

Various sites give intro methods (telling how to have the best chances of getting them to be able to live together), but disagreed with each other so I read stuff & did what seemed best as I went. Joinrats.com is the best site for all things behavior, you'll find there an answer to your other question of when do you move them in together.

Nope. The value of the cage being new is that it'll be new to them both when they're 1st in it. Intro methods talk about cleaning a cage well (plus rearranging it) to make it neutral territory when at the point you're to start having them live together, but new is even more neutral, so you can take advantage of that, after doing enough short intros as directed by the intro method you choose.

Some even say to have the new rat living in the new cage till he's marked it up as his, as a way of giving david a slingshot to use against goliath, but I found I needed to give my david only the type of slingshot that my goliath would respect the power of, not clobber in order to steal the power of!
Some even had them 1st trade cages to get used to each other's smell, but others say this & other drawn out methods just stress/agitate them further.
At one point I sectioned off a quarter of the CN with see-through plastic & sniff-holes, but as some point out, even just a cage being too big can allow them to set up territories, bad for obvious reasons. Yet someone posted that smaller than a DCN is abuse!
It's tricky but an adventure to say the least.

Thank you this is very helpful!

 

[RemyMyRattie123]

I would put them both in the new cage at the same time so they are in a neutral space when meeting. Neither one will have his "territory" marked.

Thank you I am going to do this. I just bought a Double Critter Nation today.

 

[Damnion]

On a side note though, I haven't had any problems introducing new rats before. And I just put the new rat right in the cage with mine. So it just depends on the personality of the rat.

 

[SQ]

On a side note though, I haven't had any problems introducing new rats before. And I just put the new rat right in the cage with mine. So it just depends on the personality of the rat.

Unless all the rats were under 12 weeks old, you have been extremely lucky that no one was badly hurt or killed.
Unfortunately, someday you will not be so lucky and rats will be killed - I know of others who that happened to, and they blamed the rats instead of accepting the fact that they did not do proper intros

I am writing this to share info so hopefully you and others will do proper intros ….. for the safety of the rats.
EDIT: depending upon the rats and how frequently you put the rats together, intros can go very quickly, very slowly or somewhere in between …..

 

[RemyMyRattie123]

I would put them both in the new cage at the same time so they are in a neutral space when meeting. Neither one will have his "territory" marked.

Should I introduce them first?

 

[RatsDrawBlood]

Should I introduce them first?

Pretty much all the experts say that yes you must intro them 1st & feel that what worked for Damnion was only due to the personality of the original rat or the new rats (at least at the time), or luck, or Damnion's confidence/attitude/manner. Rats sense how they're being watched or what the humans are feeling. I've only heard one or two people say that drawn-out intro procedures make things worse. Us newbies don't feel we really know what we're doing (so will be exuding worry, as we hover over them praying we make the right moves), so it makes sense to start with an intro method that errs on the cautious side, look what this page points out:
"Baby steps can be very important to successfully introduce new rats to current rats.
The idea is not to just throw new rats in with current rats in a new neutral place like a bathtub, and expect that everything will work just fine between them. It may, or may not; and if there is going to be trouble, it can be terrible trouble: One rat can slice open another's insides in a blink of an eye. (Some people do successfully introduce rats quickly, but it's not clear why they are successful.) "
https://www.joinrats.com/Intros/BabySteps/

 

[RemyMyRattie123]

Pretty much all the experts say that yes you must intro them 1st & feel that what worked for Damnion was only due to the personality of the original rat or the new rats (at least at the time), or luck, or Damnion's confidence/attitude/manner. Rats sense how they're being watched or what the humans are feeling. I've only heard one or two people say that drawn-out intro procedures make things worse. Us newbies don't feel we really know what we're doing (so will be exuding worry, as we hover over them praying we make the right moves), so it makes sense to start with an intro method that errs on the cautious side, look what this page points out:
"Baby steps can be very important to successfully introduce new rats to current rats.
The idea is not to just throw new rats in with current rats in a new neutral place like a bathtub, and expect that everything will work just fine between them. It may, or may not; and if there is going to be trouble, it can be terrible trouble: One rat can slice open another's insides in a blink of an eye. (Some people do successfully introduce rats quickly, but it's not clear why they are successful.) "
https://www.joinrats.com/Intros/BabySteps/

Okay Thank you I will do some more research about how to properly introduce them.

 

[SQ]

Since your boy is over 12 weeks old, you will need to slowly and gradually intro him to at least one other boy (or spayed girl(s) ). For info on intros see https://www.ratshackforum.com/threa...ps-used-when-putting-new-rats-together.32368/ and joinrats.com

 

[Damnion]

I guess I've always had rats with a good temperament. I've never been bitten by one and none of mine have ever bitten each other.

 

[jorats]

I guess I've always had rats with a good temperament. I've never been bitten by one and none of mine have ever bitten each other.

In my early days, I thought the same thing and just added them in until I learned the lesson the hard way. It's the worst feeling in the world losing a rat because I wasn't aware of the proper way of doing things.

 

[Lilah]

Aw he's cute! One of my first ratties' name was Remmy <3 (the darker one cuddling in the photo) thanks for taking the time and care to research about intros and for getting them the Double Critter Nation. It made a big difference for us, I wish we'd gotten it sooner.

I'd like to suggest, to please check rescues, shelters, or if rats are being abandoned on kijiji or craigslist, instead of buying from the pet shop or breeder. Most of my guys & girls (spayed) were lone rescues, introduced with the help of the advice on these forums. They became great friends. One golden hearted boy Robert Pawson had been living all alone in a small tank for 8-9 months, and very literally jumped for joy when he got to meet the other rats. For the rest of his life all he wanted to do was play and cuddle his friends. Lots of lonely ratties out there who people no longer can or want to care for, needing companionship and a good home.

For the Double Critter Nation cage, fleece blanket type coverings are awesome I think - easy to change & wash often, comfy for them, and can be upcycled into hammocks or toys, or in a pile to bury themselves into when they're too chewed up Just fold it under the plastic of the levels, between the pans and the metal pan holders below. The metal ramps can be covered too for their lil feets especially as they get older. You can get extra shelves and ramps online, more space & more shallow to climb when they get older. Litter boxes can go in the corner, "Yesterday's News" or another dust-free recycled newspaper litter is healthiest for their weak respiratory systems. I don't know if you guys have Uhaul there but the recycled denim fibre type moving blankets make excellent underpadding. Try different types of hammocks, they sometimes have different preferences but usually like the honeycomb and pocket/blanket styles, soft hiding cubes, plus small brown cardboard box houses to hide in and chew up.

DCN is awesome too if you've got a barricaded rat-safe section of your place they have access to play in - there are external ramps so they can go in and out of the cage as they like. Not possible for every space, but they owned my living room, covered in large blankets toys and box houses everywhere. The best part of the DCN was taking it off the stand for the elderly ones who could no longer really go up ramps, having access without having to climb to get back into their pad. Just a very shallow lip of the cage base smoothed over with material & a shallow incline.

Lots of DCN setup ideas on these forums. The setup here didn't have too much climbing stuff in it, and the hammocks were set to be more accessible as they were older by the time this pic was taken. Not in this version, but their favourite thing in the world turned out to be an old fitted cotton sheet piled up to make caves in a corner. Good luck