Just joined & 1st time posting on the internet! Hi!

The Rat Shack Forum

Help Support The Rat Shack Forum:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.
Joined
Jun 15, 2018
Messages
7
Location
Sydney
Hi Everyone,

I’ve recently joined as I find I browse through website a lot & maybe it’s about time I try something I haven’t done before: join an internet group and post. And yes, I’m nervous haha.

So please pardon if I’ve done this wrong or make errors, I’m a 100% beginner at this!

I currently have 3 ratties, I recently lost my older female AJ and my younger exploration rat Naughty Boy earlier this year (still grieving). This my first time caring for Aussie rats, as I’m a Canuck, so I’m used to how things operate back in Canada. Lots of similarities, but definitely differences.

I have a 2 yo neutered rescue male named KP, or Biggie Boy (everyone needs a nickname haha). He’s the sweetest, most docile rat ever.

From a breeder, half a year later came my 2 remaining 1.5yo females: Pancake (Pannycakes) & MyGeeta. Pancake is a daddy’s boy, my little princess, who must be the centre of my attention, always. MyGeeta is still coming out of her shell and becoming more social and active each month. She was super timid to begin with.

I will try to attach pictures, but no guarantees! Apparently all my phone pics are too large to upload so I wasn’t able to add a profile pic. I will find the yawning pics : )

Look forward to meeting everyone, it’s always a pleasure to meet other rat lovers and supporters. : )

Thank you in advance for your patience with me and my learning curve! : )
 

Attachments

  • 7E3E261D-5201-4E1D-94A0-921842E40157.png
    7E3E261D-5201-4E1D-94A0-921842E40157.png
    331 KB · Views: 295
  • 8D1C0D18-42DD-4BDD-91FC-DC583891A945.png
    8D1C0D18-42DD-4BDD-91FC-DC583891A945.png
    92.6 KB · Views: 287
  • F653CEE2-3A30-40B3-95F6-DA0805339641.jpeg
    F653CEE2-3A30-40B3-95F6-DA0805339641.jpeg
    25.2 KB · Views: 274
Welcome, cute yawners! What are all the differences in how things operate when caring for Aussie rats vs. Canada? That sounds interesting.


Hi RatsDrawBlood!

THanks for asking, I honestly hadn’t expected there to be much difference, so my first round of contacting people, I must have really solidified my newbie status to Australia & fancy rats here. Haha

I hadn’t realised the relatively small pool of rats that are bred here. From asking every breeder and every small animal vet around me, I’ve heard consistently the following information:

• the rat population is entirely afflicted with respiratory illness from birth as all fancy rats here have it. So it can’t be bred out, nor is that too desirable due to their special ecosystem. That’s also why new, healthy rats cannot enter for healthy breeding.

• I was a bit shocked to hear everyone warn me not to spay female rats as they will all succumb to the respiratory illness far before any tumours will affect the rat. He respiratory illness is very quick and strong apparently. [But as a side note, my first female here lived to be 2yo and never had any respiratory illness signs and passed from tumours. I have 2 year and a half old females who are unspayed and now I wonder if spaying really would have helped or not. One female, the third sister, recently passed from respiratory issues that were incredibly fierce, so it’s hard to know at this point what to believe.]

• I was also unaware that the variety of coats/types of rats was small (no dumbos, etc) but that makes sense given the strict animal import laws).

• Regarding vets, there are very few anywhere in or near the city that are able to see rats. I am used to the abundance in Toronto, but here, there are only two really to choose from. And one of the vets that advertises that all vets at their clinic are qualified to assist rats, I actually had one vet tell me she had difficulty holding my rat and I should book with one of the other vets next time as she couldn’t really do more than weigh and listen to the lungs etc.

• So, I am pretty shocked with the lack of rat vets as well as knowledge. I heard some of the rat vets tell me incorrect information about rats in general which really scares me. I am that patient that “quizzes” the Vet so I can get a sense of their knowledge. I’m no vet myself but if the vet is wron with simple rat details, I am very hesitant to trust my rat with them.

• My Vet back in Canada was already spaying rats via a new less invasive and harsh way, by snipping he tubes instead of a hysterectomy. The rats experience less physical trauma and the same results. This surgery does not exist here.

• In Canada, or at least Ontario, of which I am familiar, we have a rat breeders society where people can become registered breeders. They can then accurately use the title of Breeder as they have to record and submit their batches to the society etc so they have guidance in ensuring they are breeding for temperament and good health. As far as I’ve seen here, nothing like that exists, and someone who breeds rats can call themselves a breeder.


But in the end, I love all my rats the same, even if their respiratory illness shows symptoms early, and I do my best to visit as many vets in the clinics to find the best ones.

It’s possible that I am incorrect on some of these points, but this is what every vet and breeder has confirmed, all saying the same thing, so being fairly new to Australia, I can’t claim everyone is wrong. So the longer I’m here, the more I learn and the info I have gets updated and corrected.

But these are just the big differences bat I’ve noticed. I hope that helps. : )

Biggiesworth
 
So it can’t be bred out, nor is that too desirable due to their special ecosystem. That’s also why new, healthy rats cannot enter for healthy breeding.
What's their ecosystem? And what is it about it that makes respiratory illness a good thing?
EDIT: Oh wait, I just realized that what you're saying is probably that their limited gene pool means breeding for better characteristics makes for too much inbreeding or something like that.
PS I did understand that what you've been talking about is myco being worse there due to climate.
 
Last edited:
I wonder if by every rat being affected by a resp. illness, you are referring to myco.
All pet rats, including rats in Canada and the USA have at least 1 strain of myco. http://ratguide.com/health/bacteria/mycoplasma_mycoplasmosis.php
That is why it is important imo to treat symptoms quickly when rats are ill.
If given a good healthy diet, proper medical care, and a healthy environment, etc there is no reason why they would die young from a resp. illness
It would be very interesting to find out more about the resp. illness you are referring to, and how it impacts pet rats.
I wonder if the rats that die from it have pneumonia or Streptococcus pneumoniae http://ratguide.com/health/lower_respiratory/pneumonia.php

Spaying, neutering and other forms of surgery are of minimal risk if the rat is healthy and if you have a good vet with the experience and knowledge to do it safely. And mammary tumours often start when rats are still young so I can not imagine why spaying would not be important. In NA over 85% of girls will develop mammary tumours if they are not spayed. I wonder if where you are the % is lower or if rats develop them later in life.

As you mentioned, it is very important to ask a lot of questions, and to be an advocate for your pet rats. It is difficult to find vets knowledgeable about rats. It sounds like where you are is very different from what you are used to. I hope that you are able to find good vet care for your pets.

btw, this is a rat rescue forum, we encourage people to adopt rats from shelters, rat rescues and from rats being rehomed. Being a registered rat breeder sounds good but it is actually meaningless and to my knowledge, there are no good, ethical rat breeders in Ontario.
 
Last edited:
Hi, Welcome to you and your babes! I wouldn't know you hadn't been posting for ages if you hadn't said..
OMG, you caught 3 yawn photos, I LOVE yawn photos!
I wonder if by every rat being affected by a resp. illness, you are referring to myco.
All pet rats, including rats in Canada and the USA have at least 1 strain of myco. http://ratguide.com/health/bacteria/mycoplasma_mycoplasmosis.php
That was my thought too. It doesn't sound like the vets you've been talking to are very rat-savvy, so perhaps they misunderstand myco, or aren't explaining themselves well? We had others from Australia on another rat site and I hadn't heard any mention of this from them...
I would think far as spaying the main danger would come from inexperienced vets doing it.. Do you know if they have the same meds available there as here (doxy, baytril..)?
 
I'd understood that what you've been talking about is myco being worse in Oz because of climate & so forth. But I'm super curious to hear what this is about:
So it can’t be bred out, nor is that too desirable due to their special ecosystem. That’s also why new, healthy rats cannot enter for healthy breeding.
I later decided that what you're saying is that the limited gene pool of Aussie rats means that to breed for better characteristics might make for bad effects from inbreeding/etc. But the 2nd of your above two sentences seems to mean the health of the healthy rats would be compromised if brought into the bloodline? Yet I'm not seeing how that's a real problem or how the 2 sentences are about the same thing. I'll wait to see if there's more on this ....
 
Maybe they'd prefer sick rats that wouldn't survive if they escaped, rather than healthy ones that could overpopulate, and prey on the native animals?
 
Welcome to the Rat Shack. That was very interesting about the differences. I wonder if it's really a lack of education on their part. I used to have rats with tons of URIs until I started to feed them a healthy diet low in protein and fat which made them live much longer.
 
What's their ecosystem? And what is it about it that makes respiratory illness a good thing?
EDIT: Oh wait, I just realized that what you're saying is probably that their limited gene pool means breeding for better characteristics makes for too much inbreeding or something like that.
PS I did understand that what you've been talking about is myco being worse there due to climate.

Hi RatsDrawBlood!

Apologies for the late reply--urgent issues kept me away!

As Australia has a very sensitive and unique ecosystem, any new species that are added could detrimentally affect their populations--either by no native predators, so the new species grows out of control, or the new species becomes a predator to a native species and endangers the native population etc.

With rats, from what I am told, they do not want to introduce any healthier strains to improve the rats-as-pets population, as that could potentially affect the wild population if these new, healthier rats got loose.

So basically, protecting the wild ecosystem takes precedent over improving the longevity of pet rats, which I can understand. However, this is not coming from my own research, but rather just the Vets, Breeders and rat enthusiasts that I have spoken to, so it's possible I have been misinformed. But until I have the time to take on such an endeavour, I will hope I can put faith in what the Vets have told me.

I have noticed however, that three of my rats from one source had shorter than normal lives, with particularly virulent respiratory illnesses. My other two rats from an alternate source have had longer than expected lives (for Australian rats) and have had wonderful health. So one group of rats seem to follow exactly what I have been told about Aussie rats--short lives, quick to develop fatal respiratory symptoms, whilst the other batch is like my North American rats with a long, healthy life. All five rats kept in the same conditions over the same period of time as well, so I am wondering if my healthy two are a rare exception, or if a healthier strain is making its way around, or...?
 
three of my rats from one source had shorter than normal lives, with particularly virulent respiratory illnesses. My other two rats from an alternate source have had longer than expected lives (for Australian rats) and have had wonderful health. So one group of rats seem to follow exactly what I have been told about Aussie rats--short lives, quick to develop fatal respiratory symptoms, whilst the other batch is like my North American rats with a long, healthy life.
Trying to understand, how long is the "normal" "expected" there? And what age did your more-sensitive-to-myco line live to? And, what age did your healthy line live to?
 
Trying to understand, how long is the "normal" "expected" there? And what age did your more-sensitive-to-myco line live to? And, what age did your healthy line live to?

I've been told that a rat living to be even a year and a half is a long time here--that a two-year old rat has not ever been treated by one vet clinic even (they informed me when I inquired with them about the Australian rat lifespan).

So given that, I would assume just over a year is the "normal, expected" age. I just found that so hard to believe as it is incredibly short, but I see how fast the respiratory illness took down my rats and it does make me wonder...

Also perhaps those numbers may also be boosted so high from individuals who buy rats as pets without researching proper care, etc. I don't know how rats are thought of here by the people who keep them as pets--whether they are seen more the way people view hamsters as pets vs dogs as pets, as I am sure a common mindset would affect the lifespan percentages.
(FYI, NOT how I view hamsters--my hamsters went to the vet for regular check ups all the same as any other pet I had, but I know it is a common view that hamsters "aren't worth it" or they can easily be replaced, etc.) So if the majority of rat-owners view their pet rats more like people view hamsters, I can see why the lifespan would be particularly short--poor care, no/few vet visits and especially not seeing the warning signs of an intense (nonetheless) respiratory illness before it's too late.

But if the majority of rat owners are as vigilant and have as much love for their rats as dog owners have for their dogs, then a lifespan to a year and a half is just incredibly short and heartbreaking.


Regarding the ages of mine:

My first two--the female passed right at the age of two years due to four plus tumours that sprung up at the same time. She was my first to pass. With her, she had zero signs of respiratory illness and I was kicking myself for not spaying her. I felt silly for believing all this hype about this respiratory illness that would take them long before tumours would even arise, (or so I was repeatedly told).

At her age, it would be cruel to remove all her tumours from all over her underside. I had rats in the past of that age who had the surgery, and I saw how difficult it was on them, and I could not put her through that with so many.

Her brother, is still here with me, amazingly. When he was almost a year old, he needed two courses of treatment for the respiratory illness (light symptoms), but since then, he has had no signs of recurrence. He is just over two and half years now, and he is going strong. No signs of any illnesses.

I have one of the three sisters from the other source left, but I am sad to report she is on her last right now. She is just over a year and a half I believe. I would have to pull her records just to be certain if that was exact, but definitely around that age.

Only a few weeks back or so did her sister pass, and her third sister, the first of the three to pass would have been just over a year I think...

All three have/had seen three separate vets and all tell me these sisters have a particularly virulent strain due to how quick, aggressive and resistant to treatment it is. So perhaps they have an exceptionally bad case even for Australian rats? It's hard to say when rats are not even common at the vet clinics.

I'm quite torn on what to think given half of my rats showed no real threatening signs of respiratory illness, and the other half did. If my first two are a rare exception, I don't know if I can continue to have rats here, as a year and a half to less than that is just too heartbreaking, despite how incredibly awesome they are. : (
 
Last edited:
I've been told that a rat living to be even a year and a half is a long time here--that a two-year old rat has not ever been treated by one vet clinic even (they informed me when I inquired with them about the Australian rat lifespan).

So given that, I would assume just over a year is the "normal, expected" age. I just found that so hard to believe as it is incredibly short, but I see how fast the respiratory illness took down my rats and it does make me wonder...

Also perhaps those numbers may also be boosted so high from individuals who buy rats as pets without researching proper care, etc. I don't know how rats are thought of here by the people who keep them as pets--whether they are seen more the way people view hamsters as pets vs dogs as pets, as I am sure a common mindset would affect the lifespan percentages.
(FYI, NOT how I view hamsters--my hamsters went to the vet for regular check ups all the same as any other pet I had, but I know it is a common view that hamsters "aren't worth it" or they can easily be replaced, etc.) So if the majority of rat-owners view their pet rats more like people view hamsters, I can see why the lifespan would be particularly short--poor care, no/few vet visits and especially not seeing the warning signs of an intense (nonetheless) respiratory illness before it's too late.

But if the majority of rat owners are as vigilant and have as much love for their rats as dog owners have for their dogs, then a lifespan to a year and a half is just incredibly short and heartbreaking.


Regarding the ages of mine:

My first two--the female passed right at the age of two years due to four plus tumours that sprung up at the same time. She was my first to pass. With her, she had zero signs of respiratory illness and I was kicking myself for not spaying her. I felt silly for believing all this hype about this respiratory illness that would take them long before tumours would even arise, (or so I was repeatedly told).

At her age, it would be cruel to remove all her tumours from all over her underside. I had rats in the past of that age who had the surgery, and I saw how difficult it was on them, and I could not put her through that with so many.

Her brother, is still here with me, amazingly. When he was almost a year old, he needed two courses of treatment for the respiratory illness (light symptoms), but since then, he has had no signs of recurrence. He is just over two and half years now, and he is going strong. No signs of any illnesses.

I have one of the three sisters from the other source left, but I am sad to report she is on her last right now. She is just over a year and a half I believe. I would have to pull her records just to be certain if that was exact, but definitely around that age.

Only a few weeks back or so did her sister pass, and her third sister, the first of the three to pass would have been just over a year I think...

All three have/had seen three separate vets and all tell me these sisters have a particularly virulent strain due to how quick, aggressive and resistant to treatment it is. So perhaps they have an exceptionally bad case even for Australian rats? It's hard to say when rats are not even common at the vet clinics.

I'm quite torn on what to think given half of my rats showed no real threatening signs of respiratory illness, and the other half did. If my first two are a rare exception, I don't know if I can continue to have rats here, as a year and a half to less than that is just too heartbreaking, despite how incredibly awesome they are. : (
trails again.png.png
 
Back
Top