Bloody hard bites.

[Ame]

I found my rat Cashew outside several weeks ago. I'm new to rats so I need some help. Cashew was constantly scratching & getting bald in places even after Revolution. Some people suggested he may be stressed or bored & getting a friend might help. The vet also suggested this. SO- the shelter called me to let me know they got some male rats in. They were brothers so I got them both. One is pretty shy but ok. The other is mean as heck. He's ok for 2-3 minutes but then he'll just bite. I'll sit on the couch and let them have a little free roam. That guy will come up and bite my leg, arm, wherever he can reach. They are not nips. I've donated pints of blood to him already. I keep reading to not pull away.. but MAN!! It hurts a lot & if I don't pull away, he'll keep biting. What is going on? Is there hope for him? I'm almost afraid to get him out of the cage now or be near him and I know that's not good. I started using oven mitts but he won't get used to my scent that way, will he? I don't know what to do. I want to give them time before introducing to Cashew. I put the cages close enough so they can smell and see each other. Oh..and.. Cashew hardly scratches himself now. Could it be the new ones that helped him?

 

[SQ]

Have you checked with the shelter to see if this is new behaviour?
Has he been checked out by a vet?
How old is he?

When a rat nips, you eeeeep and pull away
When he bites, you can put him in a cage for 3 to 5 mins as a time out.
Please see joinrats.com for ideas regarding socialization - there is a lot of good info on that site

You can also see if you can find a pattern in his behaviour ...... for example, I once had a girl Cindy who would bite my face without warning ...... eventually I realised that she was trying to get my attention and that she only did it when I was distracted or on the phone because I was not paying attention to her ........ so when she was out, I gave her a lot of attention and she stopped biting me

A friend had a girl who would bite, so whenever she came close to me I would scoop her up, give her belly kisses, and put her back down, she would take off and then try to sneak up on me to bite and I would scoop her up again and give her belly kisses etc ... (Edit: she would get the strangest expression on her face when I gave her belly kisses - surprise or shock) .... I really miss that little girl

It is also possible that he would benefit from a neuter, if you have access to a good vet with the knowledge and experience to neuter a rat safely

There is info on this site about the established gradual steps for introducing rats (https://www.ratshackforum.com/threads/introducing-new-rats.34842/), and also info on joinrats.com

 

[RatsDrawBlood]

Glad my biting problem is nowhere near as bad as Ame's. But wish I was as brave as SQ. I cannot even comprehend that description. Scooping her up means putting your hands where she can bite them. Kisses means putting your lips where she can bite them. I pet her only when I think I'll be able to pull away in time if she whips around.

 

[Ame]

Glad my biting problem is nowhere near as bad as Ame's. But wish I was as brave as SQ. I cannot even comprehend that description. Scooping her up means putting your hands where she can bite them. Kisses means putting your lips where she can bite them. I pet her only when I think I'll be able to pull away in time if she whips around.

I'm the same. There's no way I could scoop him up for belly or anywhere else kisses. Nope.. not happening. I watched a youtube vid of an English woman talking about bitey rats. She said they need to get used to you holding them before you can pet them. She uses a toothbrush to pet at first. That's where the oven mitt idea came from. I couldn't even think of doing that on my own because I am so beside myself with this problem. I hope you can figure yours out soon.. and then.. let me know how you did it.

 

[Ame]

Have you checked with the shelter to see if this is new behaviour?
Has he been checked out by a vet?
How old is he?

When a rat nips, you eeeeep and pull away
When he bites, you can put him in a cage for 3 to 5 mins as a time out.
Please see joinrats.com for ideas regarding socialization - there is a lot of good info on that site

You can also see if you can find a pattern in his behaviour ...... for example, I once had a girl Cindy who would bite my face without warning ...... eventually I realised that she was trying to get my attention and that she only did it when I was distracted or on the phone because I was not paying attention to her ........ so when she was out, I gave her a lot of attention and she stopped biting me

A friend had a girl who would bite, so whenever she came close to me I would scoop her up, give her belly kisses, and put her back down, she would take off and then try to sneak up on me to bite and I would scoop her up again and give her belly kisses etc ... (Edit: she would get the strangest expression on her face when I gave her belly kisses - surprise or shock) .... I really miss that little girl

It is also possible that he would benefit from a neuter, if you have access to a good vet with the knowledge and experience to neuter a rat safely

There is info on this site about the established gradual steps for introducing rats (https://www.ratshackforum.com/threads/introducing-new-rats.34842/), and also info on joinrats.com

The shelter is not very knowledgeable about rats. The gal who said she had had rats before - not sure I believe her. I asked about behavior. They've already been in 2 other shelters. I believe they are fairly young since they're much smaller than Cashew. Maybe that breed is smaller. I don't know yet. They are super SUPER active compared to mine. I haven't let them free roam except on the couch. The mean one got under the sheet and kept trying to bite me through that. It has gotten a LOT worse since I got them 3-4 days ago. I can't afford to have him neutered. I've spent a ton (that I don't even have) already on Cashew's vet and meds. I hate to take them back to the shelter. They keep them in the heat & humidity. It's cruel. Tiny cage, no toys. NADA. They were feeding them Rabbit food. I took them in a big bunch of veggies & fruit. It makes me sick and sad. I don't know if I can get this guy not to bite or how long it might take. I've read several articles and watched a bunch of videos. I can't even sit with them now when I let them on the couch. It's scary. Those bites are brutal and I'm still bleeding from the nasty one yesterday. Is there hope?

 

[lilspaz68]

It sounds like Cashew may be hormonal. Does he hunch his back, his fur goes up, his eyes glitter and then he charges at you especially if you push him away? Pushing him away makes him even more angry and determined to get to you? Hormonal rats are a mess, they are angry, get set off into rages and bite hard. Sometimes they will bite over and over until you can get away. They often will crawl over an arm or leg then bite down. They are trying to dominate you. When a rat is in a hormonal rage you just need to remove yourself from the situation. A neuter can make a pure nasty-seeming rat back into a nice boy.

 

[lilspaz68]

Angry Oscar attacking a bottle that irritated him LOL

 

[lilspaz68]

Angry hunched puffy Nate pre-neuter

 

[lilspaz68]

Sully pre-neuter

 

[lilspaz68]

Sweet happy Nate, lucky and playful again post-neuter

Sully and Nate with their beloved girls

 

[Ame]

Angry Oscar attacking a bottle that irritated him LOL

That is so darn adorable. You know how nasty those Canada Dry bottles can be..even on a good day! Oscar is beautiful!!! Cashew has the same markings. I love it.. and I LOVE my ratty boy soooooo much.

 

[Ame]

It sounds like Cashew may be hormonal. Does he hunch his back, his fur goes up, his eyes glitter and then he charges at you especially if you push him away? Pushing him away makes him even more angry and determined to get to you? Hormonal rats are a mess, they are angry, get set off into rages and bite hard. Sometimes they will bite over and over until you can get away. They often will crawl over an arm or leg then bite down. They are trying to dominate you. When a rat is in a hormonal rage you just need to remove yourself from the situation. A neuter can make a pure nasty-seeming rat back into a nice boy.

He doesn't hunch his back, fur doesn't go up. I can't even push him away.. I just have to MOVE fast to avoid the attacks. I can't pick him up at all. I was able to pick him up at the shelter. no bites. The other things you said.. crawling on me and than WHAM. that happens. Now, I'm really afraid of him. The bites are painful and deep. I'm really regretting the decision to get them. The other one is nice but shy. I can work with him. I just wanted to help Cashew. Gahhhh!!! This is sad. I don't have money to neuter him. Do you think it can change or get better without neutering? I don't want to take him back to that sweltering death trap shelter.

 

[Ame]

Sweet happy Nate, lucky and playful again post-neuter

Sully and Nate with their beloved girls

Thank you for the story in pictures. It's beautiful.

 

[SQ]

Start saving money for a neuter or use a credit card so that he can be neutered by a good rat vet that has the knowledge and experience to do it safely.
See if the SPCA will help with the cost and discuss it with your vet, see if they will give you a discount because you adopted him from a shelter.

 

[SQ]

Here is some info on handling, helping him to feel safe and teaching him to use a transport box
https://www.joinrats.com/ModifyBehavior/Biting-Rats/

However, aggression, especially with male rats is usually hormonal, although there many be other factors as well. And as Lilspaz68 said, his behaviour shows that his aggression is hormonal

so I really hope that you will start saving money for a neuter
Taking him back will separate him from his brother and will be a death sentence
I really hope that you keep yourself safe but do not give up on him

Note: Last week I found someone to pick up a rat in another province (like a different state) that was going as snake food because he is so aggressive. His owner said that the little rattie boy had attacked his brother and his owner, biting his owner. He arrives here tonight. So far he has been ok with the guy who picked him up to transport him to me. He is going to a foster home until I am sure he is healthy and he will be getting a neuter later this month (on my credit card as I don't have the money).

BTW your boy sounds a lot like Edith ..... but hers was not hormonal as she was a girl (you are fortunate that he is a boy as a neuter will make a huge change) .... my friend taught her to use a transport box , and Edith lived with her sister and with other rats she was introed to in a large cage with lots of toys and hammocks. Edith would also have fun running around in the play area. Although my friend rarely handled Edith because she was afraid of being bitten (I loved Edith and gave her belly kissed), Edith had a wonderful life.

 

[Sheldon]

I definitely upvote the neuter. I really think it would help him. Other things:

1) shrieking each time he bites, even if it isn’t hard
2) make darn good and sure you don’t smell like food
3) make darn good and sure you don’t smell like Cashew. I got a nasty bite requiring an ER visit from getting bitten because I smelled like another unfamiliar male
4) a lot of rats will bite from the cage and from free range, but if you just hold them they don’t. I think at that point you are dominant since you take their control away. Try it

Hope this helps

 

[Fidget]

Oh Ame, you're really going thru the wringer with these kids, it's just not fair, and I feel for you! Hugs!
As SQ says, let out a loud 'Eeep' when he even makes a move to bite. If he keeps it up you can try pinning him on his back til he quits fighting you.
Neutering usually helps - but not always - and it is expensive, especially after all Cashew has cost you, so it's understandable if you don't want to try that... I had a boy (Frodo) that was neutered when he came, he was great with my girl ratties but he'd bite me HARD & deep like your guy every chance he got, and he never quit all his life, yet he didn't bite in the rescue, he just hated Me for some reason (& I've had over 65 rats and never another that was like that with me)..

Did the girl say why they've been in 2 other shelters?
I know your reason for getting them is for Cashew, not for you. I wouldn't normally suggest someone consider returning a rat to the shelter, and I know it's the last thing you want to do, but in your position, considering all you're going thru with Cashew already I think it's fair for you to honestly consider if he will fit in your life or not. He will impact your ability to have Cashew & buddy/buddies out socializing with you. You're not in a position to have him neutered, and may never be if Cashew's issues are on-going or recurring and require further vet help. I know it would break your heart, but if you consider putting Cashew & your ability to interact with him first, (& even that boy if he's like my Frodo and hates you but may be happy with someone else), then maybe you can make a decision for you & Cashew that you can live comfortably with.
It's a horrible decision to have to make, but I think both you & Cashew have earned the right to have you, him, & his buddy all happily & comfortably interacting together...

 

[RatsDrawBlood]

I can't afford to have him neutered. I've spent a ton (that I don't even have) already on Cashew's vet and meds. I hate to take them back to the shelter. They keep them in the heat & humidity. It's cruel. Tiny cage, no toys. NADA. They were feeding them Rabbit food. I took them in a big bunch of veggies & fruit. It makes me sick and sad.

Oh my gosh! You've now shown me I was right, in suspecting I shouldn't let my housemate think our rat would have a better life elsewhere just because we don't have, like, four hours a day to play with her. Maybe his free-range time could just be where you aren't, like bathroom or playpen, and you wear gloves to handle him.

 

[jorats]

If you can't afford a neuter (which would be the absolute best for this guy) then I recommend never allowing him access to you. Allowing an animal to bite, they are getting rewarded. So we need to avoid the bite before it happens. If he's around you and not biting, start giving him treats. And if this means this little bugger can't have free time anymore, so be it. This boy is highly stressed which causes him to bite so if staying safe in his cage, then that will be best for now. You can keep testing it out to see if he's still struggling with his hormones.

 

[Ame]

I'm waiting for a call back from the ONLY vet 35 miles away that will neuter a rat. Cashew was scratching himself crazy & it was suggested he could be stressed or bored. That's why I got him a pal but I couldn't split up the brothers so he has 2 now. I can't take them back. It's too mean. Amazingly.. Cashew is hardly scratching himself now. I don't know if he's too busy with the interest in the new guys or what. Now when I walk by the new guys' cage, that one guy actually lunges at me. Yep.. I think he just hates me. it's sad.