Bad or good idea?

[Ace8670]

So I've been worried about my big baby Bobo being all by his lonesome, he came for a cage with three others but has been alone since beginning on january and my gf is too worried he will just hurt the babies so... I was thinking she's at work during the evenings while I'm home ... Should I work on introducing all three of them? Or is Bobo at 18 months to old to introduce the 4 month olds? I've had their cages next to each other for two weeks now. Also a side question none of them are neutered and I wanted to get Bobo done but my vet said not to do it unless Bobo becomes to aggressive or I want to give him a female companion is he misinformed? Or is Bobo too old? I just see so many shackers with their ratties spayed or neutered. If its a good idea for the neuter but also if you guys think the intro is a good idea I will post vids of how it goes. I'm going to start with neutral intros in the bathtub first if it all looks good after a week I will move to the play area intros (my floor) ... Good or bad idea?

 

[temblabamomo]

I'm assuming the youngsters are all boys, yes?

It is possible to introduce older boys to younger ones and keep them all intact. Trying a neutral intro in the bathtub is a good place to start. Bobo definitely needs to be around other rats, so it would be good to try intros with your current group. Some aggression is not a concern - he is older and may try to assert himself as alpha rat. Or, some of the bolder youngsters may try to assert themselves. Just pay close attention and have a blanket or something ready to toss over them if a big fight breaks out and they need to be separated quickly - throwing a blanket or towel over them is a good way to break it up without shoving your hand into the fray and risking an accidental bite.

These intros vary from rat to rat. Sometimes you get lucky and everyone gets along instantly. Sometimes, you have to work very hard and be patient. Plenty of people here will be happy to give advice all along the way. Good luck!

 

[Ace8670]

Okay they have met before but always with us holding them or having our hands and arms between them in fear they would hurt each other... Here is a extremely short intro but I think freaked out more then I should've I was just worried bobo was going to hurt Marco so should I have left them alone for that squabble at the end or was separating them good?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KLwW_zElJ9c

 

[Cinderwolf]

4 month old boys are plenty big enough to defend themselves. Rats can pick up on your subconscious feelings and signals so try to be as relaxed as possible and they will reflect that. If you are tense they will be too and that could cause fights. if you see squabbling dont worry unless it gets too rough. Usually its No blood no foul. If it gets too rough make a loud noise to distract them or use an igloo or cardboard to put between them ( careful grabbing with bare hands, soem rats can bite you good while they are tryignt i attack another rat. But I doubt with proper calm and slow introductions that a big fight will occur. Just beleive in thema nd beleive in yourself and go win with a good attitude and it should all go swimmingly

 

[Ace8670]

So try again? I noticed Bobo is alil puffed up but he isn't walking sideways at him or anything it's just Marco was squeaking. I'm just worried with bobo being twice their size it could only take a split second for him to hurt one of them if he really wanted to

 

[Cinderwolf]

Just realized there was a video bahaha.

It looks liek all the rats were pretty comfortable. no one was overly poofy or huffing (which are both signs of agression or annoyance or territorialness) You older boy was a tad puffy i tihnk but not much. I think that the end scuffle was jsut that. It looked like your older boy was tired of the young one poking at him so he flipped him and power groomed him to put him in his place. but it didnt see any real agression in any of them. I think slow introductions will result in a nice little trio that gets along well. next tiem you can try a plate of soft food liek baby food so they are forced to eat along side eachother ( only if you feel comfortable doing so)

Yea I woudl definitly try again but not right now give it a day for thme to calm down.

Are their cages next to eachother? to help them get used to each other you coudl put the cages next to eachother ( nto close enoguh to attack through the bars) and every day or so switch who gets what cage.

 

[Ace8670]

Yeah their cages have been side by side for two weeks at least now not close enough they can bite each other through the bars but about 4 inches apart

So I will try again tomorrow and post another vid hopefully it lasts longer then three minutes I just know if bobo hurts one of the babies my gf is going to put me on a stake :? But I don't think it's fair for bobo to be all by himself and since I'm now working more he is gonna need a friend and if this works out and they are all doing fine I'm sure my gf will warm up to the idea

 

[dspch911]

I'm going to start by saying I don't know anything about merging rats, but I'm going to learn quick, but after watching your video I have to agree with cinderwolf. It looked to me like the little guys were like annoying little brothers and wouldn't leave him alone and he just showed him who's boss. My guys would do that all the time - I currently have 5, but by Sunday I'll have 10! They never hurt each other. Hopefully merging our boys, your 3 and my 10 will go well for both of us... Good luck

 

[Ace8670]

:thumbsup: Lol thanks I think that it's just because if one of my gfs babies gets a bite mark she is gonna kill me so I'm overly paranoid about fights My best friend told me if bobo wanted to kill one of them it would take a split second and there is nothing I could do about so that's not helping.. I will be better tomorrow :thumbup:

Bobo and his previous cagemate Pixel who passed away

 

[jorats]

According to that video... Bobo is not an aggressive rat. What a sweetie!!!! An aggressive rat would lunge and attack. If he was a bully, those babies would have been scared right away and stayed away from him but they didn't! They wanted to smell him and be near him. I would definitely try again.
Put the cage next to each other but not too close, you don't want them touching each other. The goal is to get them to smell each other and "talk" to each other too. Keep doing your intros. If you are only comfortable with 10 minutes, only do 10 minutes and gradually work your way to longer.
This is so awesome... I love Bobo. The babies are pretty cute too.

Oh the question on neutering, it's not so much that your vet is misinformed it's what he's comfortable with. I get my rats neutered at all ages. That's because I have an awesome vet.

 

[victoria]

I agree with Jo, I prefer to neuter and spay everyone but you have to go with what your vet is comfortable with. If they're not comfortable or enthusiastic, it's probably best to avoid the surgery if you can. (Sometimes vets are TOO enthusiastic about surgeries and that can be even more dangerous.)

 

[dspch911]

My vet said not to neuter either - I called and inquired before getting the boys since everything I read said I should!? So I wanted to have everything ready to go. I'm glad I was reading rat behavior right and Bobo wasn't being aggressive - he looks like such a sweet boy. Now that you mention talking to each other, I have to ask. Now I know they are not parrots and aren't going to repeat things, but every time my boyfriend making clinking noises at Curley that darn rat will click back at him... I swear the two hold a clicking conversation. I've read that that can be a respiratory thing so believe me I have that poor rat up to my ear more than a telephone and I hear nothing. That rat just clicks......he will climb on his shoulder and click in his ear.... So what kind of talking will the rats do with each other?

 

[Ace8670]

Okay since was apparently just me freaking out last time I'm going to try again since its been hours their cages have been next to each other for quite a while I'm only going to ten minutes tho I'm upload the video as to the whole clicking noise is it teeth grinding? I don't think mine have ever clicked Bobo chirps idk why he does it when I put it back in the cage or he does it through the cage when the other two are goofing off too much in there cage the vet said he was perfectly healthy tho I still don't understand why he chirps the vet said it might be him just coughing? Idk but I will be back in a few to upload the video

 

[victoria]

My vet said not to neuter either - I called and inquired before getting the boys since everything I read said I should!? So I wanted to have everything ready to go. I'm glad I was reading rat behavior right and Bobo wasn't being aggressive - he looks like such a sweet boy. Now that you mention talking to each other, I have to ask. Now I know they are not parrots and aren't going to repeat things, but every time my boyfriend making clinking noises at Curley that darn rat will click back at him... I swear the two hold a clicking conversation. I've read that that can be a respiratory thing so believe me I have that poor rat up to my ear more than a telephone and I hear nothing. That rat just clicks......he will climb on his shoulder and click in his ear.... So what kind of talking will the rats do with each other?

Neuters with a good vet aren't unnecessarily risky though. Beyond preventing pregnancy, neutering makes almost all males rats less nervous and happier as a result. I sterilize all my rats unless there's a medical reason not to, I'm just fortunate that I live somewhere with a good exotic vet.

 

[jorats]

dcpch911, I bet he's grinding his teeth. That is such an honour when a rat does that, it means he's super content. Rats can also brux when very scared but I doubt that is the case with your bf.
As for the rats, they send each other signals and talk in a frequency we can't hear. We can hear them if you use a bat detector.

 

[Ace8670]

Sorry it took so long I couldn't get the video to upload it was alil shorter then 10 minutes Bobo was getting irritated so I figured enough for today here's the vid sorry I accidentally clipped the button at the end so I pressed it again real fast so you could see the fight

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=q3IIqh94sOE

Here's part of the fight I broke up it seemed like it was going too far :
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wzk-OyLq6Nw

Idk I can't tell if this was good or bad Bobo just seemed to get more and more puffed as the minutes passed

 

[Cinderwolf]

Cant watch atm but if you think it is goign too fast and he si getting stressed out you can move back a step, start switching cages alternate who is in what cage it will help with the smell and get them calm aroudn it, get thme used to being in one territory

 

[Ace8670]

Idk if that's a good idea I tried the switching cages once and Bobo like exploded all he did was pace in their cage along the side his cage was and when I moved them back in their own cages again he huffed and puffed at them in the other cage through his and wouldn't stop it was like a total backfire I had to remove Bobo to another room completely for three days for him to calm down enough where he was chill their cages being side by side again that's why I wanna get him fixed but I'm also wondering if I need to find a new vet because he was spastic about the cage switch

 

[GrayLightNewDay]

Idk if that's a good idea I tried the switching cages once and Bobo like exploded all he did was pace in their cage along the side his cage was and when I moved them back in their own cages again he huffed and puffed at them in the other cage through his and wouldn't stop it was like a total backfire I had to remove Bobo to another room completely for three days for him to calm down enough where he was chill their cages being side by side again that's why I wanna get him fixed but I'm also wondering if I need to find a new vet because he was spastic about the cage switch

My rats have been living in the same cage together for a week now. It took two weeks of the cages being next to each other, one week of bathroom meetings, and then one week of playing on my bed with me before I felt comfortable enough to put them in the cage together. I tried the cage switching thing and my first rat, Navi, would puff up and pace, while huffing and puffing all loud, trying to lunge towards the other ratty in her cage. She never got puffy and angry during the bathroom intros or the bed intros, it was just Calista being in her cage that bothered her. So, instead, I would clean their cages and after a day of them going potty I would just switch the actual bedding and litter. Then the next day I would switch it back again, and after that I would start fresh with clean bedding again. They were able to get use to each others scents and whatnot, without making Navi throw a tantrum. :giggle:

Your big ratty is definitely reacting well towards those babies, though. Much better than Navi was towards Calista during their first intros.

 

[GrayLightNewDay]

Aww, I was watching more of the video Intro 2, and at around the 4:15 mark it is absolutely adorable. The big guy is suddenly in the middle of the two babies, and he puts his dead down all sweet and cute towards one of the littles like he wants to be groomed! That is a good sign. When I saw my Navi doing that I knew that they would be able to bond.