HELP PLEASE! Identification and Care!

Hi guys from London, UK, my name is Nia! I'm totally new to this forum and I'm sorry to drop like snow on your heads with this rodent issue of mine. Also please forgive any newby-faux-pas But I need urgent help with this tiny critter that accidentally came into my procession yesterday.

Here goes:...
I've no experience with rodents, although I've been wanting to adopt a pair of ratties for the past 6 months. Anyhow, I don't even know WHO this is. First I thought it was a house mouse, then I thought it was a vole, now I'm thinking it might actually be a wild baby rat... I've been looking at pictures online and theoretical word descriptions all day, and I'm CONFUSED! So now a vole seems to be out, since the tail looks longer and the ears aren't furry. Is it a full grown mouse? But the ears seem a bit small? No? Is it a baby rat? It sure acts like a silly baby!

It doesn't appear to be injured physically, but it was disoriented, when I found it in the middle of London traffic. It seems to sleep like literally MOST of the time (never goes exploring), i checked on it during the night as there was a teeny sign of movement. But it does eat whatever i lay in front of it (carrots, oats, seeds... those seemed safe for all rodents). I'm not sure what to do with it... I'm pretty sure it won't be able to forage for itself if I let it go in the park.

Please help me identify the critter, so I would know what care to provide and where to release it if it regains its strength or whether it would be safer domesticated with me!!!

Here are some pictures.

P.S It seems to be ever-so-slowly adapting to new environment, although it still barely moves it finally made a bit of a nest out of the cotton cloth I laid for it/him/she. Before it just sat on top shivering.

P.P.S. I have also placed the container next to the fireplace (not too close ) and I think "it" enjoyed it immensely, as it's now always next to that wall.

I can't tell you if it is a mouse or a rat ... but I sent messages to a few members who will be able to tell you.
I am also unsure what you have available in the UK for blocks

Here is a link about a member that kept a wild baby rat that her cat brought home,
as a pet http://www.ratshackforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=23622

vegs and grains are good, such as cooked quinoa
Here is the forbidden foods list http://www.ratshackforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=590

The little one needs to be kept hydrated so drinking water is important
Organic soy infant formula is the closest thing to a rat mamas milk so is fed to baby rats

You can make a temporary carrier out of a large plastic bin and cut a hole in the side and top and cover the holes by attaching baking cooling racks over the holes (on the inside of the container) with cable ties/zip ties
For example, Here are some small ones http://www.ratshackforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=22614
Here is a large one http://www.ratshackforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2279&highlight=bin+cage

Rodents are social and live in communities and need one another for survival
so if it is an adult mouse and you set it lose, I would think that it would need to go back to where it came from
so it can return to its family (to my knowledge, unfamiliar rodents are enemies and usually killed)
If it is a baby rat, it will need to be socialized as a pet and introed to at least one other same sex baby rat because it will never be able to survive if set lose.

btw animal rehab centers tend to use small rodents as food for other animals

The little one looks very sweet.
I hope it continues to improve and does well in your care

Such a cute little one - what a lucky babe to be found by you. It is tough to tell from the pictures if it is a rat or mouse, but from the size I would say either a full-grown mouse or a baby rat. And yes, the ears seem small in relation to the head to be a mouse. If you can take a belly shot of its privates, we can probably sex it for you. I'm thinking baby rat...
I fostered a couple of baby mice for a few weeks and I fed them KMR (Kitten Milk Replacement) from the vet's. Here is the link to the thread - have a look at the pictures.
http://www.ratshackforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=27529

Thanks so much for all the suggestions! Much appreciated Yep... NO! There was never any question of sending it to RSPCA (our wild animal care system in the UK), wild mice and rats especially are considered pests and would be exterminated for sure! So the only question is do i keep it or release it if it recuperates, so it's even more crucial for me to know what it is and how to treat it. If it's a full grown mouse that just got knocked on the head a bit, that's fine it knows how to survive and there's a park not far from where I found it (i suspected it might have originally come from there, but it was a very busy crossroad where I picked it up and a high wall in all directions, so that was very strange...) If it's a baby that needs more care, well that's a whole other story! I have been reading that thread you suggested SQ ;-) cheers

I've put it into a 7 lt plastic tub for now, but it doesn't go exploring!!!, which is what worries me most. It eats solid food well, oats is a particular favourite I noticed. It has water in a small bowl, but I don't know if it's been drinking it, as I haven't spotted it. So I included celery and cucumber slices as well, because they are watery. They are organic, we get our veggies from the market, and they got nibbled. I tried the pipette with glucose water, and the creature wasn't interested even to lick it once.

I guess the bases are covered for now, I too really hope it pulls through whoever it is.

Ha-ha, Joanne, I don't know about lucky, we'll see i guess but he/she was indeed in serious danger of being squashed by passers by if not by heavy London traffic. I tell you they all thought I was mad scooping the thing up, but he just looked so lost :-( and didn't even try to run, which surprised me. Probably realised by then there was nowhere really to run in that place...

pet rats also like peas and pieces watermelon and cantaloupe

I would say baby rat.. I had a mousey visitor in my house a few winters ago.. the cats had a go at him so I scooped him up and put him in a bin for a few hours to make sure he recovered and wasn't injured before setting him free:



Mice have bigger ears on the tops of their heads, whereas rats ears are smaller in proportion and more on the sides. Comparing my photo to yours I would think your little one is a baby rat. Based on his size, he may still need some milk replacer/baby soy formula...

There's some good info here as well for comparisons between adult mice and baby rats:

http://www.ratbehavior.org/RatsMice.htm

If you intend to keep him (I dont think he would survive long on his own being so young), I would try to find a few domesticated and well socialized babies to raise him with. I would also handle him as much as possible!

You said you found this rat?
Why would you take it? Wild rats are different from PET rats.
They could have diseases, etc. I know you might have saw it distressed and wanted to help, but nature is nature and you shouldnt take something out of its habitat. Sick or not.

Please dont try to "adopt" wild animals. They arent meant to be. If they cant survive in the wild, then they cant.
It happens.

Just my thoughts.

RattieTaffy said:

You said you found this rat?
Why would you take it? Wild rats are different from PET rats.
They could have diseases, etc. I know you might have saw it distressed and wanted to help, but nature is nature and you shouldnt take something out of its habitat. Sick or not.

Please dont try to "adopt" wild animals. They arent meant to be. If they cant survive in the wild, then they cant.
It happens.

Just my thoughts.

Click to expand...

We saved numerous wild mice and the chance of disease if very low. Nature is nature but it does not mean we as humans have to watch an animal suffer and die. Those days are over with as many wild life rescues taht are around. Wild animals need help as well not just domesticated pets.

I would have to say that is a rat. Rats taht are wild dont really adjust as easily and may be skittish but some people have kept them. I can send a message to one who I know has.

We kept our wild mice because we spoke to a wild life rescue and they said they may or may not survive in the wild. No it isnt ideal, I wouldnt go out looking for wild life as pets but all of ours (4) came to us as babies without their eyes even open yet. So it was us or death. We can hold them, they dont like t much but some do. They do love their cage mates and thier wheels.

We used KMR on the mice it was good, this oen however looks old enough to eat on his/her own. You can give some formula if he seems weak but I would personally see if there are any wild life rescues that can give you advice. We found a deer mice rescue by googling it LOL I couldnt believe there was a whole website on it. We even named our mouse after the man who helped us through the baby weeks.

RattieTaffy, I can appreciate your point about "adopting wild animals" or "taking them out of their habitat" on purpose. It's not something I would encourage myself, and I would've never taken this baby out of the park or a wood, where there's a chance its mother could be nearby, otherwise yes let nature take its course. But I found it at crossroads with quite heavy foot traffic and transport, and there was not a single patch of grass in sight only brick walls, so not a natural habitat and it seemed unfair on the little guy. I still have no idea how it could've gotten there in the first place. But it didn't seem obviously hurt or sick, so I thought I'd give it a chance to survive.

I took it with the intention to release it in the nearest green (which is actually a park) once it rested a bit. It was only later that I realised it might be a baby rat and not a full grown vole/mouse. And now a baby needs care or maybe even a permanent home with me. Trust me I don't take this responsibility lightly, but it felt right, so I did it!

Fancy rats ancestors were too once domesticated somehow, and I know plenty of examples where absolutely wild animals bonded to humans through various interactions, so it's totally doable, but does depend on the individuals. I'm not saying I deliberately want to keep it as a pet, if it survives I'll play it by ear depending on his/her temperament and habits.

In these types of situation I think it's right to help an animal in distress. Even wild animals have been known to adopt other species's broods on occasion, sometimes even humans. It's not a norm, but sometimes the exceptions happen even in nature. But that's just my opinion. The deed is done anyway, so the point is moot. And now I'll just have to figure out what's best for it.

Since it is a baby rat you will need to post good pictures so we can help sex it
You may also want to see if there are any good rat owners in your area who might be a good source of info and help
The baby will not be able to survive in the wild if released, no matter how old it is.
It would not know how to survive, could not survive by itself as rats live in family groups, and would be killed by unfamiliar rats

You will need to handle the baby as much as possible every day, to help it become well socialized,
otherwise it will not be happy in captivity
The baby needs to bond with you.
Some pet rats also have the same agouti colouration as the baby

You will also need to get one (or more) same sex babies, about 5 weeks old to bond with the baby
Rats are social and need to live with other rats
One or more other babies will help the baby to feel safe and help it adjust
to its new life and learn how to be a domestic rat
This will need to be done soon

All the best with your new baby rattie
s/he is very sweet
Have you thought of a name yet?

Btw, rats tend to bite gloves, socks etc so I would stop using gloves when handling it, and cuddling it

Here is a thread by some members in the UK about what is available re diet for rats, etc
http://www.ratshackforum.com/forum/showthread.php?t=32286&page=2

The recommended diet for rats is
80% good block (around 14% protein or less) available at all times
20% daily vegs (incl greens like kale) and occasional healthy treats like a piece of fruit, cooked grains,
cooked cereal, organic pumpkin seeds, etc

It is good to supplement young orphaned babies with organic soy (human) infant formula.
This can be thickened with organic baby cereal.

hope this helps

btw, does the baby seem ok .... I was thinking that it might have been
dropped by a predator to end up where you found it

Just a little update: the little thing seems to be doing a bit better. I'm still not a 100% certain it's a rat, but everyone seems to think so, therefore I think I'll treat it as a rat until proven otherwise, and call him a he as it's just easier than keep calling it "IT".

I had a bit of a panic attack this morning, because he appeared rather weak and was shaking or having tremors (possibly bruxing?), but at the time I thought he was at death's door. His breathing also changed, his fur is "puffing out" a lot more (so breathing deeper i think) and the breathing seems faster than yesterday, he also wasn't really interested in food this morning. But after an hour of further slumber, he woke up ate the oats and proceeded straight to the water of bowl in the other corner of the container. So he obviously visited it before and remembered! After that he groomed for a whole hour, if yesterday he only cleaned his whiskers then today's routine was a head-to-toe treatment. But after that he went right back to sleep again. Overall i think it's an improvement... I'm now beginning to think that it was just really stressed out and exhausted by his central london ordeal, especially if he's young. He looks a bit "wobbly" on his feet, I remember my cat used to be like that as a kitten. I noticed him doing a round of the container as I'm writing this, followed by more eating and grooming.
So i have a couple of questions:
1. Do rats generally look a bit clumsy, when they walk or just babies?
2. Is the breathing thing ok? I thought it was bad, like laboured breathing would be in humans, but since it's more active than previously, perhaps this is what's "normal" for rats?
3. How old do you think he is?
4. If i were to release him, at what age should i do it?
5. If i were to keep him, how best to start interacting with him? I think it still might need a bit more time to gain more strength either way.

Thanks again for all your answers and suggestions so far, it was very helpful!

SQ, that's what I thought too! Because we do have a wild type park in that area with owls living there! Another thought I had that his mother might have been transporting him and something spooked her, so she dropped him there. But what's odd is that it was right in the middle of the busy afternoon... but then again I don't know how long it's been sitting there.

Oh, and I see you've already posted some good info regarding my thoughts, SQ. :thumbup: I'm a bit slow at typing my posts today

The baby may be ill from the stress.
If you can post a video people could look at it and see if the breathing is ok
if the baby needs to see a vet and be put on antibiotics.

You might get a small stuffed toy for the baby to cuddle with until you can get another baby
Just be care full of what it is stuffed with and any small pieces because the baby may chew a hole in it.

Ok, so it seems releasing him wouldn't be a good option then, huh? I thought it might be the case, but I'm ok with keeping him. As i mentioned I was actually thinking of getting a pair of domestic ratties anyway, so it seems strange he'd appear like that. I'll need to know for sure what sex he is before I go shopping for a companion though. It also might be hard to find such a young rat. All the ads I've seen were for at least 8 week old rats, and sellers specify not to ask for earlier rehoming. Most of them are 10 weeks+ anyway. And of course i have to make sure it's healthy first!!!

I'll have to try and get a good picture of his privates, but I've read it can be unreliable at this age? I don't even know how old that is... Ha-ha, no names yet, this morning I thought he was a goner for sure, but I'm a bit more hopeful seeing him a bit more active today. Still far from what I'd expect from a baby rat though, he grooms now, but definitely not a playful fellow yet. So should i start interacting with him right now? Or give him a bit more time to acclimate? If he just wants to sleep, wouldn't stress him out?

Not gonna lie, a little bit afraid of touching him without gloves. He did bite pretty hard today (it would have drawn blood, if not for the glove), which hasn't happened before. But for the first time my boyfriend was in the room and he has quite deep voice, so may be that spooked him. I noticed the rat definitely reacted to his presence. Also hygiene? Should i wash him? I wash my hands after touching the cage and such, but i don't want to be a hypochondriac, but if he bites that's a different story. How should i start handling him and for how long a day? I work from home, so i can do that.

He looks like a wild rat to me. About 3 weeks old, if it's a he, you should see his testicles by now.
I know a few people who were able to tame wild babies, turning them into wonderful pets...but it's a lot of work. You'll need lots of socializing and having stable domesticated rats to show him the ropes will be highly beneficial.

nialings said:

I had a bit of a panic attack this morning, because he appeared rather weak and was shaking or having tremors (possibly bruxing?), but at the time I thought he was at death's door. His breathing also changed, his fur is "puffing out" a lot more (so breathing deeper i think) and the breathing seems faster than yesterday, he also wasn't really interested in food this morning. ....... 1. Do rats generally look a bit clumsy, when they walk or just babies?
2. Is the breathing thing ok? I thought it was bad, like laboured breathing would be in humans, but since it's more active than previously, perhaps this is what's "normal" for rats?
3. How old do you think he is?

Click to expand...

He may be ill and may need to see a good experienced rat vet and be put on antibiotics

Edit: like azithromycin (10 mg/Ib, from a pharmacy by prescription from a vet) + possibly baytril (10 mg/kg). Both are given orally twice a day for at least 6 weeks if helping

Rats become ill and die fast

Rats will bite gloves etc
Rats are like cats, they groom themselves and since he is old enough to eat solids he can groom himself, doesn't need you to wipe his butt like a mama rat. Like cats, people rarely if ever bath rats unless they are elderly and need some help.
Is he toileting ok?
How is he breathing?
You might want to start contacting people with rats and tell them you need a 5 wk old baby to be friends with an orphaned baby

You can put a piece of cloth in with the baby that has your scent on it
I would cuddle the baby and stroke him, etc
(Babies do climb and jump so I hope your container has a lid with a grid for air circulation on it, if baby gets lose you will have a difficult time catching him)

There are a ot of threads on here about people raising babies, raising orphans, etc but the link I gave you likely contains some of the most relevant info

Post good pics and people will be able to give good info re the baby's sex
Female pet rats have about 12 nipples while males only have a belly button, if that helps.

He may be ill and may need to see a good experienced rat vet and be put on antibiotics

Edit: like azithromycin (10 mg/Ib, from a pharmacy by prescription from a vet) + possibly baytril (10 mg/kg). Both are given orally twice a day for at least 6 weeks if helping

Rats become ill and die fast